Game Style Compromise!

Too LD & Dark_starr

I say, i understand that 100%, allot of the kids playing this game just won’t be able to cope with losing all their hard work in 20 seconds to a pk.
I understand its not UO days!

I really feel this is a strong idea. For reasons i will explain now:


Story: On Great lakes server (what i know) there was a time (short time) when the game forced
high end item collectors to come into Fell for epic drops... Well of course the PK/Fell community wasn’t going to have that! Many guild’s came together to make one, POS (protector of spawn) All players coming into the area for a time, had to deal with this pk group if they wanted to get to the high end drop areas. Sadly, this did not last long, and due to a difference of opinion by some of my fellow players, the drops were included over in tramm…..


Solution:
Take a part of the map, a rather large section (20%??) and make it 100% open play. If you enter this zone, you are 100% open to looting, attack, ridicule, with an overall miserable outcome, if you're not 100% prepared!

In this area, all players are flagged for 100% open PVP
This area is 100% loot open
This area will be given (by the game DEVS) 100% exclusive drops of items, not available any other place on the map
This area will feature a dungeon of some kind
This area will have a top tier mining vain
This area will have house lot options
This area will feature very high lvl monsters (Keeps the new characters from needing to be here)
One town 100% open, with red character banking/shopping options.

Benefits of this type of area
Population control, you know in what area the majority of reds will be. (Future in game options using this area!)
You add a whole element to the game, that won't be available if you use a pvp off switch on 100% of the map...
(PVP off switch is fine in the rest of the world, that way pvp players and pve players alike can enjoy it if they choose)
Your pk/pvp community will have an area to call home.
Your advanced pve players will have a area to come to fight, as they like. Or not ever, if thats what they choose.
So everyone is happy…..

Pk/PVP players have a area to roam, They can farm/bank/live just like everyone else

Devs have a HUGE amount of options in game with a area like this in future updates!

PVE players will have have the option to come to this area and get epic drops, (other epic
drops all over map also, just SOME of the drops in this area are exclusive to this part of the word)

PVE players can hire people to go farm this area via protection, or even hiring a guild too go into this hostel area and retrieving an item of desire, or opt out altogether, and never experience the thrill of the food chain.

So whats the score, who gave up what?

PK/PVP community concedes the cry for 100% open pk/pvp play, with full loot whole map…(never going to happen= pipe dream) PK players understand that most players want to be safe and enjoy the land, and shall be happy with a small area, compared to NONE!

The PVE community understands there is other play styles in game that people enjoy!
They concede it fair for there to be one small part of the world, that could kill them naked, if they choose to enter it for financial gain or a dumb mistake! They also concede that it is fair for there to be 100% unique, exclusive drops in this part of the world, seeing how they have the rest of ****80%*** to play safe, if they choose…

DEVS concede PK/pvp are players too, and if you want that money, you have to allow the game to suit them as well.

Final ideas:

If the Devs of this game take the steps to create this area, the game will have much better longevity. It simply adds an element to this game that CAN NOT BE without this Zone!
It adds risk and reward, something missing if everyone can do everything safe…..

You have a whole new story line option in the future (you can figure that out, the options are endless)

You have a 100% filled, happy community of players (there will always be cry babies on both sides that don't know how to compromise)

The majority of players want pvp sliders, they got it on 80% of the map
With an opt on option if they choose
The majority of pk/pvp players want full open game play you got 20%
They will still have other players IN PVP mode outside the 20%
Who gave up more in this compromise?

Also, guild vs guild war...100% open full map, no reason not too!

So I really hope all groups can look at this and not get so self absorbed…
Think about the other play styles that would like to enjoy the game as you do!

Please don't use this thread as an area to argue who is right and who is wrong, its been beaten to death! Please all pk/pvp players and all PVE players state your chosen game play style, and sign below your support, stating you agree to compromise some of your game play style so this community in a whole can make this the best damn world ever created!


Compromise!


I attend this thread to research an idea, and see if the community in the whole, can come together and compromise?

 

We already have this in the game. It's called dynamic contested resource nodes.

$1.7M: Dynamic and Contested Resource Nodes + Optional Minimap System
Meteorites, volcanic eruptions, outbreaks of rare plants and animals can appear and vanish suddenly (online and offline) for those who are paying attention. Some PVP focused resources appear in tile
Optional minimap system for the directionally impaired!
The Lost Vale – A new mini-adventure centered around a lost valley previously hidden to players, now visible only during special astronomical alignments.

Beyond that, we don't know how PvP is going to work in this game or if there will be permanent, dedicated PvP-only "zones" or "hexes" or POIs (e.g. dungeons), etc.

 

Welcome to the forums.

I see the Selective Multiplayer already being developed as the compromise, or the lack of needing too. It is designed to allow people to play without having to carve up the map or the servers. Players can play single player online up to open world and consent to PVP or avoid it. There will even be a Full Time PVP Guilds, so no need to sacrifice or compromise. Those that don't want to PVP won't be matched with those that do, and vice verse.

Have you seen the other threads on these topics? A lot of this ground is already covered and the Mods tend to merge similar threads.

 

OP, I'am so confused.

 

""Beyond that, we don't know how PvP is going to work in this game or if there will be permanent, dedicated PvP-only "zones" or "hexes" ""
Well that's the whole point of the thread, having the community help with suggestions on how it should all work together. It's a very hard decision for them. I bet nothing at this time is 100% in stone, when it comes to this issue. I'm sure of it.

 

I really believe that's the thinking as of now, but to be honest, i believe that is not close to how its going to work in game.

 

This is why it is a dynamic event. They do not want to section off a section of the world just to placate one particular play style. 20% of the map is PvP only? Sure, how about 20% for pure crafting, no PvP allowed. Ok, another 20% for Permadeath zones only. Ok, 20% for RP only, no PvP or PvE, etc. What about another 20% for <your play style here>?

This is the beauty of Selective Multiplayer Logic. You don't partition the world, you partition the player base when they want to play that way. So instead of 20% of the world being PvP only, you get all 100% of it. If someone, say a crafter or whatever (PvE) wants to be "enticed" into PvP, they just need to flip that switch and it affects them nearly everywhere vs. the 20% you want sectioned off.

 

From the stretch goal, I can see a PvP focused resource such as taking control of a castle, giving the controllers, be it a guild or a coalition, and any that they choose, access to vendors, crafters, maybe missions and a tithe from both controlling the castle and for any PCs that spend money within the castle. Or taking over a mine, and anyone that uses the mine pays a 'tax' on what they gather to the owners, or pay them for the use of the mine at all. In both instances it'd fall to the group that controls the resource to defend it, and anyone on their territory.

Every so often, another guild or coalition could challenge for control of the resource, anyone else in the area can choose sides and then see who holds what. That sounds like lots of fun Especially if I could help one side or the other hold or take and not be tied to a Guild. And if the people running the resource are jerks, then the guests that are accessing the resource can help overthrow them, or defend them if they like being under their rule.

Looks like Dynamic is separate from the PvP resource, especially since it highlights Dynamic as available in 'Offline' mode... So the rare gathering resources are just randomized in appearing, rather than being tied to the PvP.
... I like that a lot more than some of the discussions I've seen where they've been tied together.

 

"I say, i understand that 100%, allot of the kids playing this game just won’t be able to cope with losing all their hard work in 20 seconds to a pk."

Let me save you a couple thousand words.

Don't flag for open PvP.

Everything you said after your first sentence is covered by those five words.

 

Moving to PvP thread.

 

I think some people that replied have missed the whole point....

The whole map will have a pvp option..on off .... unless you are in this small area....

Lets say i'm out mining....Will i be in pvp mode, and risk all this work? NO...... Which is okay, and smart...But, it also removes a whole game element out. No longer can ANYONE go out and hunt a miner for his gold...
Because everyone is wearing the (safe tag) which makes it ZERO risk (less a monster attack)

With this open area, you add back that element to the game....without effecting the game in a whole, matter of fact, you add MANY more future options. The most important thing you allow is, risk and reward.....

It is not asking too much for this small section... 20% is just an idea, devs would decide how much....This area would play just like other areas, only difference is its open 100% once you enter....no pvp flag. The reward for risking the trip here, would be unique item drops, and mining areas. This will force people into this area if they
want the rewards...

I have played games sense D&D.....I HAVE NOT played a game serious, long term after UO (8 years) I have watched these games afterwards come and fail, one after another.....Reason?

NO end game......People come in, they craft everything, they hunt everything, they figure out all the tricks, they get all the items, then what do you do? Wait for the next expansion? People get tired of waiting, so they go and buy something new to KILL TIME

Reason: Because the game is the same day after day after day.....UO never had this problem, the players made the game, it had so many options, it changed by the day or faster! IMHO all this was based on risk and reward....You could go craft one day. mine the next, pk
one day then love the next....only difference? You had to watch your back....This is what makes a game, no risk all the time = boring

ALSO:

If you make the world a 100% built in safe mode..... you just lumped yourself in with every other game on the market. You will be judged as so!

If you add in a element, most haven't had in years, allowing the game to have SOME risk and reward, then the world will change daily, due to players having way more options. This will allow for a little forgiveness on things that aren't up to a huge budget game standard, because the game play is so * EXCITING.....people want to play....


No risk? all reward?....Fun for a few months while you do everything for the first time, then not so much, then boring on Townie mode talking at the safe bank. You give players a option to go out and get some rare ore mining. He has to sneak into a land were he could lose his head any second, get his ore and get out. Now see, that's just one example of a game that will never get boring, because the players create the game!

Maybe he makes it, no pks in the zone, whew thxs God, i snook past all the pks to the north....

Or maybe he dies? Darn, almost made it, Darn, red caught me 2 clicks from the safe zone...

Every trip into this ZONE is a different game, and that my friends is what makes it great....

*edited for language - Koldar

 

I still have hope that PvP has some purpose, rather than being reduced to a minigame.

 

Thank you

I see this as a compromise. Only this zone would be 100% open. Only this zone would have NO SLIDER option. Only this zone would offer unique drops, nodes, not available on the rest of the map. You want to get those benefits, you have to come play smart. The rest of the map would be as designed.

So what are we really talking about then?

Making a part of the world a zone, Dev's can decide how much, but not a arena type please, rather large zone. Build it and people will come!
Adding some unique drops, only available in this zone. People will come for that!
Adding or using an existing small town as open play city, banking plus shopping for all! No safe zone

With that, everyone can be happy with the game, PVP & PVE players alike. For very little change.

 

PVP stays as designed now, with this idea! Only thing that changes is in the zone, no safe pvp slider. Rest of the world will still have pvp as designed as of now. Idea changes NOTHING of what is in place, it just adds a more extreme element to the game, many people would like to see.

 

Don't get me wrong. I am completely in favor of full loot open PvP everywhere, including permadeath, and I too want all of that to have meaning. I'm also in favor of content geared towards different playstyles, including custom PvE and PvP quests. I even pointed out dynamic contested resource nodes for everyone, including PvP. I'm in favor of dungeons and other POIs geared towards particular playstyles. But that doesn't mean different players can't explore the same area and have different experiences.

I just happen to think permanently sectioning off a portion of the world map to placate some playstyle is misguided. If the devs do that for PvP, they will have to do that for all playstyles. To quote the OP:

The 20% of the world being proposed is essentially an Arena. Why limit yourself to 20%? Selective Multiplayer will give you 100% and everyone will get to consume the same content (persistent world) yet yield different gameplay experiences.

 

None of your post makes any sense. What is a "PvE" player? What is a "PK"? Is this zone FFA or are there teams? Is there Karma? Why does it exist? You're trying to pull a bunch of elements from other games and just globing them together.

 

Not sure how many kids we actually have here.. unless a kid is anyone under 30.

 

Because i don't believe your view of how this works in game, is right.

If everyone has a slider, and can enter safe mode whenever they like, how many
players are going to go farm/mine rare & and valuable drops unsafe? Very few, which
kills a style of game play many people enjoy. It will be non existent!
So instead of arguing full world open pvp, Pipe Dream...i say offer a small zone
and create some unique drops in this zone. People can choose weather they come in this zone or not.
Its not a arena.....its a area of the map you walk into, it plays just like the rest of the game, only difference is its not safe.
The rest of the map has the as designed pvp system in place, safe switch?
So nothing changes, this is just an area were this safe switch wont well make you safe! :}
Not sure why that's a bad thing in anyone's eyes? Don't want 100% open play, enjoy the rest of the world, but don't
tell all other play styles you can't allow us to enjoy the game as we like too!

Edit: just read your last post, i would love full open pvp/pk with loot etc etc...never going to happen. So this is a compromise. It should be enough to make both schools of player happy. A little for everyone.
.

 

Greetings avatars! Please keep this thread civil, following the Forum Rules. You are welcome to disagree about PvP and options for it, but do it respectfully. There are to be no personal attacks.

I would also like to take this moment remind everyone about Forum Behavior and PVP posted by @DarkStarr a couple months ago.

Enjoy your discussion, but please be respectful.

 

I am still shocked that people do not know what karma or virtue is. Anyone who has not played a game with these elements involved go back and play Ultima IV - Ultima Online. This has been a consistent theme throughout the entire series, which this game claims to be a descendant of.

The slider may work, I don't think any of us know the exact details of how it will work quite yet. However, the slider also means that everyone in the open world is flagged. Why else would anyone enable the slider to PvP if they were not aware of the risk involved?

This means that a player who is evil cannot be played. Everyone has already provided their consent to be killed. I don't have a problem with consensual PvP so much as I have a problem with meaningless PvP. The "zone" as OP mentioned provides an area that makes players vulnerable whether they like it or not. It also means players in those area are capable of being killed by an evil player or a murderer. This creates a society where there are evil players (murderers) and innocent players (those attempting to simply gather resources). In an arena a player is pitted against one another without any of those elements involved, it is meaningless.

I think we are on the same page other than perma-death. I think this is interesting feature, but what happens when you get killed after investing several hours into a character? I am quite sure you would have a problem with it, albeit you are claiming the opposite is true. This is possibly a bit too extreme for most players, whereas full loot in an online environment that isn't gear centric is not quite to that extreme. I honestly think it might be cool to have perma-death, but I have never witnessed that feature in a game other than pen and paper Dungeons and Dragons.