Is It "Not" Being The Hero That Can Make An MMO Great?

I recently saw this Rolling Stones Article. The premise of the article makes it worthwhile to read in its entirety. Please note: I am not trying to make comparisons to World of Warcraft.

The take away, for me, from the article, was about how Vanilla WoW went away from the paradigm of being the "One" hero in a game. They started with anonymous characters (the players) and made it so group play was required to get through content. And not just from the wave of people who started to play, but from everyone all the way up to the first 40-person raid and all the way through the first expansion.

In the end, the story and quests themselves were nothing to remember. But as the article points out, people remember the experiences they created with one another. Vanilla WoW, whether or not it was intentional, and whether or not you think the expansions are what ruined the genre (they did), created something that many of us played and remember fondly.

Yes, afterwards, the creation of the Dungeon Finder went away from this. Cataclysm literally destroyed the world and revamped the game (for the worse?). Etc.

In SotA, we have this concept of the "One" Avatar, and I know this is an integral part of Ultima. What Portalarium is doing may be different, however, than a lot of the current games out there, and that is to have some sort of single-player narrative alongside group play.

My criticism is on their initial attempt to meld the two (single-player and group play). It seems they have focused on making those two aspects distinct recently, and I think this is a good move. I think it is a good idea to continue with the single-player game. The only bridge, in my mind, would be in certain dungeons/areas to require teamwork. This is a good move. This is just my opinion, but I think it might be shared, of how things have sort of diverged with these two aspects. And that is good for the game.

With respect to group play, I am hopeful that Portalarium will create a lot of mechanics in the future to give players that feeling of needing to group with others (if a player wants to). Whether this is in the form of re-vamping the Control Points, creating more PvP and GvG mechanics, creating Factions, having a Justice System, scaling content, or any of the great ideas the community has put forth. Edit: I would add Overworld Map Encounters to this list as well (and that it could "scale" as well).

This last one (scaling) is something I am hopeful Portalarium will consider. It's not just about creating Tier 6/7/8 mobs or zones, but taking the Friends Only mode and scaling it to the highest level player that enters (whether solo or in a group). There can be problems with this (exploits?), but mechanically it could make for some more fun content with little investment. The zones are already there. The mobs are already there. If a player is Adventure Level 80, 90 or 100, entering a T5 zone is not that challenging. But if the mobs there "scale" up to the player, making things a bit more difficult (especially with a group of mobs), we have endless new "content". Is it something that a level 120 could exploit, yes, but I am sure that some counter-mechanic can be created to make this less a possibility. Edit: To be clear, this would really seem to work only in Friends Only mode; it would be too difficult, if not impossible, to make this work well with the current tech in Multiplayer mode.

This is just one suggestion, and the community has put forth many more. I know I am being an "arm-chair" developer, and that things are much more difficult to implement than they are to think up. But I know this community is full of good and constructive ideas, and I know Portalarium has implemented some of them in one shape or another.

Just my two cents. Discuss.

 

Well said Magnus. A polite way to make constructive suggestions that would benefit everyone.

The scaling is something I've often thought of as well. Going into a dungeon that got harder based on my level and how deep I went in would keep me coming back again and again. And imagine if the loot scaled as well! But loot doesn't always have to be gold or plain items. There could be unique deco items, patterns or even a title to earn if you survived XX level.

 

I totally agree. The focus should be on group play. Some elements of the story should only be completable if we are in a group. As some areas already automatically switch us to multiplayer mode and flag us for PvP we could have areas we can't enter unless we are in a group. This could even expand to quests. The questgiver could say that he cannot give us te quest unless we are in a group with other players. This would put the focus much more on the multiplayer aspect of the game. We could even take this further. Have the whole group being flagged for PvP and let them meet other groups who try to do the quest. The group who wins does get some bonus.

 

I have never like the idea that every game wants to place the player in the role of the hero. That catalyst that moves the story forward.

I would much rather have a world/story that lives and breathes with or without player motivation. A persistent world that allows us to become a hero but not written as if we are the hero.

Anonymous grouping such as what WoW does with looking for group isn't all bad. It does allow for quest content access. Making it a feature for the main game loop probably isn't the way to go. That depreciates the value of close nit groups, or guilds.

I like the idea of scaling across the selective modes. I thought I saw the devs talking about scaling a few times but I haven't looked up the progress or if it was punted to a later date (hopefully not abandoned)

Scaling can be painful when over used though. The way many of the Elder Scrolls games did it was actually a punishment if you didn't build your character correctly. (content out scales the power of the character) I think Skyrim did a much better job at the scaling compared to the earlier games.

 

I agree entirely with Magnus. My favourite memories from all the MMO's I have played (primarily but not limited to ; Ultima Online, Dark Age of Camelot, Star Wars Galaxies, Lord of the Rings Online) are those that stem from some sort of group/co-operative play in many different contexts - dungeon delves, raids, pvp, rp etc etc.

I think striding through SOTA (in any multiplayer mode) as a sort of demi god (once all the grinding is done ) is for me a major weakness of the multiplayer experience in this game. Currently there is not nearly enough reason to interact with one another in SOTA both in combat situations but also trade and crafting as well.

 

As much as I now like the quests and the story, I have to agree. SotA would be better off being just a sandbox in which everyone could write his own story.

 

I might be taking the term sandbox different than the standard interpretation. But sandbox to me is the opposite of story. The lack of story. The player's experiences in game are the story's to be had.

I wouldn't want Port to stop that type of sandbox. I do not want that to be the main game play though.

Much more like the Ultima series. I'd prefer many many many side quests. The main story in Ultima games were great but so many of the side quests have longer lasting memories.

SotA can do even more with dynamic questing. A little bit of something for any play style. Or huge story arcs that the players can push in a collective direction. Lots of potential.

 

I do agree that in the Single-player mode of the game, the player should be "The One" Avatar. And in the multi-player game, they're more like a "special select few".

In regards to team content in SotA (control points, dungeons, etc)... my biggest gripe is there's no point to them; not really. You go into a control point and hold it, facing waves of faceless, nameless baddies.
You go into a dungeon and clear out generic creatures. You open a couple chests along the way, tap a few iron veins.
Beyond that, there is no experience. There's no sense of real accomplishment, or completing a story...because there is no story. Just "rooms full of generic mobs" that need to be killed.

That's the main difference I see between SotA and other multi-player online games. WoW dungeons give you a story. They're filled with trash mobs, yes. But there are encounters with mini-bosses and a final boss. Each fight is different. Learning is part of the fun. The experience of learning is part of the fun. Can't tell you how many times we've laughed (or cried) because someone flubbed a mechanic of a fight and was launched into a wall, or off a cliff, or some other oopsie moment.

I think the biggest weakness in SotA right now is how they create their encounters. There really is nothing exciting about almost all of them. It should be something they work on, IMHO.

 

I think it would be cool to clear out zones in friends / party mode. Start in Soltown sewers and just keep going clearing out as many areas as you can. Clear out the Foothills and the mines and the swamps. How long would it take to clear out all of Novia?

 

excellent post... my thoughts exactly.

 

Scaling in this game isn't just a level thing, but a skill thing. Rather than just scaling everyone up I'd prefer lower skill caps put into place for certain areas/dungeons/mobs. Having it so anybody in these zones have a skill cap of 40 and you not only have a generally easy time adjusting the mobs to a set difficulty, but you allow lower level players much more evenly paced group content. Due to everything being crafted in this game the rewards for such zones would require something everybody could use. Item skins, furniture, bulk resources, gold, but I'd also like to see zones that require being unlocked through group areas that might offer such similar rewards or story content. If you beat 'group zone' another zone gets added to your overworld map as an unlocked feature. In order to enter 'evil castle' you must first reach said evil castle.

The new zones might be single player, but require multiple people to traverse certain areas, even should they be something like a puzzle rather than a difficult fight. The group zones could even be full of puzzles, secret areas, Easter Eggs, unlockables, ect. Anything to make someone over group chat say "Ooh, look at this!"

 

Even in single-player games I don't think being "the hero" is what makes them great. There are some single-player RPGs that have really no story to speak of and consist entirely on survival and sandbox elements. They're fun because you get lost in the world in your own way, and are driven by a different sort of goal-driven gameplay to keep things going.

As far as RPGs with a story go, the main value of being "the hero" is just that its harder to create quest-driven content where you don't end up solving problems, achieving goals, defeating obstacles, ie being "the hero." Not impossible, but harder.

 

Reminds me of Harvest Moon. You're 'technically' the hero as you are appointed a run-down farm to bring up to speed for the benefit of the community, but at the same time there are equally important facilities within said community that your farm is no better nor worse than. Animal Ranch, Orchard, Mines, various shops, ect. These are mainly plot areas where the story takes place that you can interact with, but at the same time your farm doesn't really have an impact on them. If anything, they are more important to 'you' than you are to them. If you are not using the facilities chances are you are chasing romantic interests or boosting friendships which may vary based on the day or season.

The story isn't about you being the hero of this RPG, but rather being a part of this RPG.

 

Nearly every RPG except for SotA has a very bad story. Even books and movies are worse.
Games should not have a story unless it is written by designers like RG or Tracy Hickman.

 

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/scaling.103502/

 

You're on fire

 

Yea, though then there's figuring out how to do the multiplayer aspect of it, which would mean you don't have every player doing the same quests for the same people. I can think of ways to do that, but it would be a big job in terms of implementing.

 

I think that is #6 of the TOP TEN priorities before launch!

 

Just the pants