More npc's in cities please

I would just like to say that Ardoris felt a bit lonely when I went there and examined the city.
So - I vote for more wandering non-itelligent npc's please (until you replace them with more purposeful ones) - it will make the villages and cities feel more alive!

 

I agree with this....now...is it kept low for performance reasons?

 

When they release a new area like this and it's basically just art to walk around in, what are we supposed to make of that?

 

Perhaps a thing they might consider for every village/town/city is to pre-populate every lot with houses,
and that every house brings, I don't know, 2 wandering npc's with it for the time being, to see how that feels.
When a player claims a lot 1 of the 2 wanderers might disappear.

 

Agreed more NPCs is a much. The towns feel empty at this point.

 

I actually enjoyed not seeing a lot of meaningless NPC's in Andoris. The few players I found there were idle and I actually thought they were NPC's. It wasn't until I approached them and tried to have a conversation that I realized my mistake.

The entire game (not just Andoris) is dead to players. I keep bringing this up because people keep ignoring me. But as the world grows, without significant player activity the world will feel this way even more so.

That's actually OK because frankly having a lot of players around everywhere you go is bad too. But what's not ok is going to a big city like Andoris and feeling completely alone.

FOR LAUNCH: A big city needs a reason to have people and not just NPC's (that's just another way to make the game feel dead). Kingsport has plenty of NPC's and it's dead too. There has to be attractions that draw the players into the city. Players need to have a reason to mingle, hang out, chat, and do stuff with one another. It's like if you're playing basketball on the playground. You're going to goto the playground where all the other players are. Then you're going to wait for a "pick up game" and have lots of fun just "playing basketball" with complete strangers. It's something that happens organically. But the fact that there's a basketball hoop and court there has A LOT to do with it. What's in Andoris exactly? Nothing.

The other thing that is going to make the world feel dead is the server architecture. Again, I keep bringing this up and people keep ignoring me, but it's a fact that isn't going away anytime soon. The servers currently hold approximately 100-200 players before they make new players goto a newly created instance. That means that while 100 to 200 people are in a thriving town...there are a few people that are standing around a ghost town thinking "wow Andoris is freakin dead! This sucks!" and they're right.

For every Pax Lair event where Darkstarr and RG show up and see a great play or a crowd of people watching maze races, there's another instance somewhere that had almost no body doing anything. That's a problem, a very big problem. So I don't see "more NPC's" being a good solution to any of this. In fact, I think it will make the world feel even emptier.

Of course, if you're planning on never seeing other players and just playing single player mode then I guess you're used to the world feeling dead and have come to expect this level of interaction.

 

Um what? How is playing a single player game being used to the world feeling dead? Ultima 7 never felt dead. At the moment it has a lot more feeling of a MMO then any single player game I have played. They don't need a lot of meaning less NPC's they need to have a lot more meaningful ones.

They need to add more npc's, they also need to adjust how the world splits players up so their is a minimum level as well as a max so that you don't feel so alone.

 

Well i've said this from the beginning. You can add all the towns you want. If the goal of this game is to have all towns player driven, that will make for a big problem as towns will be just places to drop off goods to your dwelling and trying to find the area of the world with some activity. So far and albeit the game is in alpha, the towns really seem blah. I dont want to go to a town designed by game designers simply to look at other player's housing. There was a lure to the old ultima towns because they had great architectural and NPC identities. Skara brae had ghost stories and sailors and a nautical feel. Yew was secluded And attuned to the flora and fauna of the surrounding land. Britain was somewhat metropolitan with surrounding rural britanny. The companions helped tie you into each town as did the non companion npc's and they drew you back again and again. And im sure other players chose their favorite haunt to make their "home". Housing fills a niche for those who want the UO experience but i think ultimately impact town and gameplay negatively. What happens to the game if the number of players does not meet expectations? Lots of empty towns, without the developer driven npc's and content to sustain. Hopefully my concerns will never come to fruition, but time will tell.

 

I'm generally for more NPCs to make a city feel alive too. However, not so many that one cannot figure out which have quests to give and which do not. Also, hopefully the game will ultimately have NPCs with visibly notable jobs - like a boy walking with his dog, a lady working a flower cart, a fisherman, a ships hand swabbing the deck, etc. Too many NPCs just standing around just trying to look cool really isn't. But I don't think we should expect much either, the game is still a pre-alpha build. Plenty of time to polish towns.

 

This is one of the main problems the devs have to overcome: it's a single-player game, so cities need to be full of "living" NPC so they don't feel like ghost towns. It's also a multi-player game, so cities need to be bustling with players and not full of meaningless NPC.

Drocis' concerns about server architecture are very valid too, but it's not something with an easy fix. Servers can't have an unlimited capacity. Distributing players evenly among multiple instances could "fix" the imbalance on busy sites, but be very problematic on less crowded areas and, even if that was only done for big cities, it would still be a problem for player driven events as they'd still be limited to one single instance, even if they're filled evenly. And, of course, traditional "shards" are out of the question, not to mention they'd have the same problem regarding player events...

 

The single player experience in a mmorpg...can it be done? To be determined. I'm not even sure selective multiplayer will work as the world will seem that much more empty

 

One solution could be to offer cites (including player cities) the ability to distribute "attractions" and "events" evenly across the game using "stages" and "main streets" that would cross over every instance so no one was left out. For example, the "maze" could be broadcast over all instances. It would have a limited number of people that could participate in it. But everyone could "view it". Is this technically possible? I don't see why not, but then again I'm not very technical and it sounds like something that could be very complex to develop.

 

Not sure why people here are assuming that the devs aren't on this. I never assumed that Ardoris was NPC-complete.

Things to make big cities livelier :

* Functionary NPCs RG already suggested would be in the game -- lamp lighters, street sweepers, etc.
* Lanterns on the buildings the docks.
* Street vendors on side streets, not just in the main market.
* Fishmongers by the docks advertising fresh fish. Also people selling other sea foods like crabs, eels, rays.
* Maybe a farmers market by the docks.
* Street entertainers like tumblers, acrobats, jugglers, and mummers. In some cases stages (like Drocis suggests).
* People trying to lure players into gambling games, like a shell game.
* Shady people, who I guess have to be extra shady or be caught by the Oracle.
* NPC traders by the docks. These can be randomly generated and different every time, since they aren't residents. Some can offer financial opportunities for the players.
* NPC hirelings by the docks and in pubs and inns, randomly generated the same way, so hire-able.
* Stray cats and dogs. (Sometimes sleeping).
* Birds on the ground eating stray crumbs.
* Seagulls on the rocks by the dock.
* Beggars, homeless, cripples.
* NPCs lining up at bakers every morning to get hot, fresh bread. Going to the main market for produce.
* NPCs dumping waste products from their respective industries before they leave their jobs in the evenings.
* Delivery persons, messengers.

 

redfish, if the game is at a point in time in development, so too is the feedback.

I don't know why people assume that feedback is always definitive. When someone says "I don't like this in Release 9" that's all it means. The assumption should NEVER be that the devs are "on it". The default response should ALWAYS be, the devs are too busy, this is too complex, someone forgot, didn't think about it, or simply dropped the ball. So here's a reminder devs "blah blah blah, release 9".

This doesn't hurt anything and should only be perceived as helpful.

 

Drocis,

Its not even whether it hurts anything. I just don't understand the reaction. I came on the thread and the first thought on my mind is "Why are you guys thinking this?" They've already talked in videos about how RG wants things like lamplighters, streetsweepers, and so on.

But I think it would be cool if we can have some constructive discussion of what things could be added to make Ardoris better.

In the mean time maybe some Dev can stop by the thread and explain whats going on in their time table.

 

Only sir baron francisco drocis, you are hyped out of your mind !

There is no limit to instances, only if you want to pay as little as possible on cloud instance fees.

Then there is a whole array of instability that arise from lag and bad library handling which dozens of companies have solutions for ($$$). Indeed using the "industry standard" is not going to work here but the devs can't afford more power than necessary, especially when testing, especially with current structure which is really straight out of the box and completely disregards lessons learned in UO.

I have solutions since 1999 but I have yet to meet someone that can understand my language

 

You have rarely been so out of touch ! Take a deep breath, don't be afraid to care...

I kinda forgot why I wasn't supposed to say this, ah I'm not perfect !

anyways ; imagine how frustrated those who bought this game for single player would be if the devs had to say "sorry, but half the money went to maintain this cloud so we could test out combat and pvp..."

we're simply not talking about making the world "look livelier" we're in to something deep and we're passionate.

Just go take a walk/drink a beer... forget bout it. Don't mistake passion for piety !

 

@Ahuaeygnjgks,

I bought the game largely for the single player, too. Just not sure where all this anxiety is coming from. :/

Nothing wrong with piety, btw.

 

I was talking specifically about what the devs said the game limitations were. About 100 to 200 players per instance. If you want to argue the technical legitimacy of those figures, talk to them. I'm but a lowly sir baron francisco! What do I know?

 

That's fine, and yes it's always better to try to look forward and stay constructive. But I don't have a problem with calling a spade a spade. If the OP doesn't like a lack of NPC's it's better to say it now rather than later. Again, the assumption should always be the that devs are so smart and so completely good at designing this game that they may from time to time forget little things like this. Or as you say they may have a master plan where it couldn't help to fall through the cracks. In any event, it doesn't hurt to call it out until it's "fixed."