Navigation through New Britannia

Exactly this SOTA is yet another fantasy game in a sea of fantasy games. A lot of people are going to wait and see rather then jump right in when they have tons of other options. SC on the other hand has very little competition. I mean there is EVE Online I think and maybe a few others but really not a lot of competition. So it is not surprising at all they have had a lot more success with their funding.

 

Those type of things aren't that bad at this stage....just driver issues which will be ironed out...

If that's a major issue to someone playing now....don't play alpha

 

not really sure what the point of this thread is right now... is everyone so desperate for PVP that we need to create it here on the forums?

i WILL say i got a little sad when i hit the overland map briefly yesterday. gosh i like the style, really pulls the heartstrings for some reason

 

Once again, per their website, One year later they were at 18 million. not 27 million. sept 6, 2013. And once again, these are very different games, catering to very different audiences. (I know more people wishing for a new space simulator rather than wishing a new fantasy MMORPG would be made).

 

It's a small improvement mainly brought on by the bloom post effect which takes all of 5 seconds to apply.

The bigger problem with SotA's art is the lack of consistency in style (or even a defined or distinctive style), followed by under utilization of shader technology. Hopefully the Unity 5 migration will result in marked improvements for the game on the shaders and materials front, but a major effort will be required to convert all the materials and to reign in the art itself so that it doesn't feel so generic and lacking in style, character and consistency.

 

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/?p=39961

They've been adding artists.



You haven't been paying attention if you think they just added a bloom effect. R5 and R6 both included major revamps of their lighting system from R1-R4.

here is more info on that:

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/release-5-post-mortem.10454/

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...elease-5-impressions-release-6-revised.10408/

 

Yeah it is not a massive change or anything but it does look noticeably better then last release for instance. I think in future releases we will see even bigger improvements graphically. I am especially excited to see them improve the characters those imo need the most work out of everything at least art/graphics related!

 

ummm. what happened to the conversation there?

 

Yeah and I suspect switching lighting models and making everything work correctly with this new model takes far more then 5 seconds.

 

It definitely seems to be jumping all over the place doesn't it! Lets see where it jumps to next! lol.

 

I didn't say they only added a bloom effect. I said the small noticeable improvement is mainly brought on by the bloom effect.

Switching to linear lighting also takes about 5 seconds from a technical standpoint, though it does necessitate further tweaking which definitely takes longer than that.

But the fact of the matter is, the game still looks bad compared to the competition and it's going to take a lot of effort to fix when they could have done it right the first time with proper direction.

They haven't been adding artists at the rate that is necessary for a project of this magnitude and I strongly suspect the experience level of their new hires has been low resulting in minimal overall benefit.

The proof is in the very statistics you cite and it is further bolstered by a look at the resulting output over the last year. It's largely modified Unity Asset Store purchases and a small amount of original content.

 

Well

-I just want to clarify I don't know why the posts that aren't on topic are here but the ones that are were deleted-

 

Ahh I did not know that wasn't following the thread that closely *and I was at work for much of the day*

 

I don't wish to inflame this thread further. I really don't. But I do want to point out a few things.

There's nothing wrong with saying your opinion on whether the team itself is doing the right or the wrong thing, the only thing that bothers me is that people who don't have experience doing any kind of game development or large project programming coming out of the woodwork to offer how "they'd get it done" or slate the game like it's done.. stick a fork it it. It failed. Like they're talking about a project that launched today or something. It's in an open development model which people cannot seem to grasp. And yes, it's gonna be late. probably WAY late judging by how things seem to be going lately.

Go look at the wish list threads of people coming up daily with new systems they want to see in - it's pretty easy to see expectations are not managed properly and people are imagining the most amazing game ever on a shoestring budget.. something even a software powerhouse like Bethesda can't even come close to achieving. This is partly Ultima's own fault for how good those early games were.

As far as Star Citizen, Star Citizen isn't even a playable game ! We're STILL a week away from the dogfight module ! The Hangar Module is cute and nice and all, but SoTA has more features than that currently, there's at least running around, multiplayer and a rudimentary game loop for the users... and Star Citizen not only has more money, but it's ahead of us schedule wise as well ! With that perspective, I don't think we're doing so bad !

Now, I'm disappointed by the problems I encountered in R6 today on OS X, but I have perspective. I know OS X isn't as important as getting windows going.

It *was* working well for most of R5 for me, except for a couple regressions. So they changed a bunch of stuff and didn't test well on OS X or whatever happened, or they knew about it and were willing to accept it to get the windows client out on this brutal monthly schedule.... I have to accept that OS X and Linux is just gravy at this point and I can't expect it to work well outside my windows VM. I can't expect Linux or native OS X ever from Star Citizen. Maybe 2017 or 2018 ? And maybe only OS X ? Who knows.

I do think the rhetoric needs to be turned down on all sides. I include myself as well. I think the criticism needs to be more focused and constructive on what needs to be fixed instead of long diatribes from new forum members, which happens every release, btw, getting people riled up about the success or failure of the entire project. It's not productive and it doesn't make anyone feel good, not us longtime forum users, not the devs, not the guy on the fence about whether to back the game, nobody.

Just take a moment to reflect on your post before you send it off in a nerd rage, I beg of thee.

 

tradyblix, 99% of what you've contributed to this thread is noise. You're spending your time arguing against points no one is even making and ranting.

Go figure you're the first one to cry about the deterioration of this thread and call for an end to it.

Also, your thinly veiled insults toward me are not appreciated. You are making wide-ranging assumptions and completely missing the mark.

Maybe you should remove yourself from the debate so the adults can have a decent conversation.

 

Tamino,

I'm not talking about you. I'm talking in general about behavior, of which yours is just the latest sorry example, that happens every release.

How can you expect anyone to take you seriously when you say that ?

Who is the troll, a guy with 15 posts making ad hominem attacks, calling people children and telling them to clear off, or someone who is a dedicated member who believes in the game and is helping to test it ?

No, I won't leave this thread because you requested it, that is just preposterous.

By the way you're on my ignore list from now on so don't bother making a long, wordy reply, I won't see it.

 

Why don't you do some searching on the unity asset store and show us these models that they reused? The ones in SoTA and the ones in the store. Also, If you've used unity or really any graphics engine you know lighting isn't that easy to change out. I seriously doubt the veracity of your claims of being a developer now.

 

Why would I need to prove that assertion when the developers themselves have already publicized they make extensive use of the Unity Asset Store? It's a well-known fact. Close to 90% of their environment art comes from there and a large portion if not all of the animals and monsters.

Switching to the linear lighting model in Unity is seriously barely a 5-second change.

Altering scene lighting and materials tweaked under a different lighting model is where the development team spent their time in the changeover. However, it's possible to write tools to automate those type repetitive processes and if they did that work by hand, they wasted a great deal of time. I've written tools like that many times in my career. In fact, I wrote a batch processor for Unity scene files fairly recently.

 

What little art was made specifically for SotA is mostly sub-par and lacking in stylistic direction or cohesiveness, especially the architectural models.

Minor props, other than those obtained from Unity Asset Store packs, were mostly crowdsourced and I won't comment on those.

The dungeons, caves and sewers were decent enough to get a pass but still sub-par.

The character art is decent if you look at the original sources and some of the armor and weapons are okay. There's some good stuff in there, but unfortunately there's also some pretty abysmal art mixed in and again that is due to a lack of cohesiveness and stylistic direction.

But the art quality is being degraded as it is converted to be game ready to the point that I question why they're even using ZBrush to sculpt in detail which ultimately just gets lost. I mean the game as it looks now could be pulled off using nothing but diffuse textures.

Hopefully they'll go back and up the quality and start using some of that extra detail which exists in their original source art. But they're going to run into the problem where the Unity assets they bought won't have the same level of detail which is going to bite them in the ass if they try to do this as it will highlight the lack of cohesiveness in the art.

Still, it's probably better than starting from scratch, if you're on a tight budget. I tried to point out earlier that it wasn't necessary to be on such a shoe-string budget in the first place, but I digress.

Level / environment design is a very serious weak point in the game right now. Hopefully they have a few competent level designers or will find some when / if they ramp up content generation.

It's kind of hard to design good levels without a bunch of good art to work with though, so art production really needs to increase and fast.

 

You haven't even seen the unique things they have designed in game yet.

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?forums/founders-art-gallery.23/

You can't just batch process the lighting changes and expect it to look good. It is not a 5 second change.

And no, not all of their animals/monsters come from the unity store, the ones that did they completely fixed up to look a lot better none of them look like the originals.

here is a link showing their HUGE improvements over the unity asset store purchases.

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/very-bad-graphics.6879/page-7#post-120239

Their graphics look very good, especially in release 6. There were big improvements between 4 and 6. Minecraft sold well and people love it, as long as the gameplay is excellent, people will play.