Open PvP Justice System

dont flag pvp, is the mechanic. I dont know if you remember or not but players could post bounties for thier killers in UO, if you killed off the bounty you automatically got the money for the bounty. or you turned in a head either or a bounty board would work for PVP

 

Of course certain people will always go against bounty for whatever reason, it can be exploited etc..... so goes the same long song and dance! No matter what i come up with it will be argued by those same people even if it may help out the cause, im used to it only room for PVP to negotiate with PVE not the other way around same ole same ole, those people just need not consent for pvp or they will never be happy at all!

 

You may not see the need for balance within systems but there is always a need for balance.

Why would someone put themselves at risk of being a target when they can avoid it by either unflagging or dropping out of Open Play Online. When there is balance they won't do so.

Even the best PvPers can choose to take the path of lease resistance when they have other objects in mind.

The victim doesn't open up to being a PK target there is never a victim. The PK gets nothing and there is no bounty. The UO model does not fit here with the multiple modes of play. But the Tram/Fel can be used as a slight example. What if all the targets move to Tram and there is nothing to PK?

 

There definitely needs to be some kind of murder/criminal system so that we can establish our own player run justice system, (or to even just keep it from being chaos). (innocents are people flagged for PvP, but was not opposing you in way nor in a guild war with you. Not legally attackable).

Otherwise there will be no such thing as PKs, PK hunters, and nothing to make anybody think twice about betraying an ally. I think the part about betraying an ally is a really good reason to have such a system, but also without a system like this there would be nothing but chaos (anybody attacking anybody for the sake of attacking people). That wouldn't be fun for many people.

If there is a specific consequence for betraying your allies or attacking innocents (Not PvE players)... then that means they will likely only let you attack people who are specifically your enemy. SO in other words without some kind of criminal system, you might only be allowed to attack people from a guild you are at war with, or people in an opposing faction. So there must be a designation for murderer if we are allowed to attack ANYBODY flagged for PvP.

I would hope that we can attack anybody that is flagged for PvP, but not without consequences.

 

How about a phantom flag system?
There will be a HARD flag system, so that people can opt out of PvP entirely. Then there will be certain events, and locations, that flag you PvP, and certain locations, and probably events, that prohibit PvP.

How about a second system, using near identical code, that is used inside PvP, where you are AVAILABLE for PvP at all times, but have different significance in PvP terms, say...

Not Flagged in open space - I am not actually PvPing, I'm living dangerously while I mine or chop lumber
Not Flagged in a fighting zone - Yeah, I'm a combatant, but I'm not engaging anyone, just here defending myself and doing whatever the zone objective is
Not Flagged at a fighting event - I haven't engaged yet, I'm waiting for my moment
Flagged in a "peace" zone - I'm openly challenging people to duels, if they take me up on it...
Flagged at a "peace" event - I'm crashing this party, let's see what you've got!
Flagged in open space - I am looking to PK
Flagged in a fighting zone - Form ranks, prepare to attack on my command!
Flagged at a fighting event - Bring it ON!

This sort of thing could be only partially under player control, so that acting a certain way gave you certain visible flags, and based on your flag status, attacking or killing you would trigger the justice system (or not).

 

I think the justice system should be in place at all times, with maybe declared wars and duels being the only time murdering someone does not fall under the justice system. But I think you are on the right track with have several types of flags to prevent holes or allowing griefing with a justice system.

 

There will always be someone to pk, Us the PVPrs, it is a way we like to play and we accept that we can be pkd, so if all the "lambs" are not there it doesnt matter. The Pks will just have harder targets to PK, ones that will turn around and kill them! Builds excitement for the PVP and PKR while this is happening, targets may be chosen more wisely, and not all the kills will be easy for them. I dont see the problem with that? The pkr will just have to be challenged.

 

Then there is not point in a bounty system...

1: The post that this quote is referring to was deleted because it was loaded with some rather inflammatory comments.
2: Is that how you really take this comment? Do you really think I am saying suck it up and do things my way? I am saying people here on these forums are actually starting to come together and have productive discussions.

 

ok i gave you the benefit of the doubt on that post so i deleted my post on that, it was how it sounded to me. If that referring to a post that was deleted then that should also be deleted by you so people dont take it like that is the only thing that was said, yes there is still a need for bounty if im a pk hunter it would be nice to make some money doing what i do, then taking that money and fixing my gear or getting better gear, or even paying the rent on the house i may buy with the money i collected. there is nothing wrong with that. you should probably delete the part where i quoted you since i deleted my post to stop confusion.

 

For you to get your bounty, does the victim have to do anything, like report the assault? Why should they report it, they don't get to watch or partake in the kills.

The cycle of events is PK kills innocent > innocent reports crime > bounty hunter kills PK

PK wants to kill innocents, other wise it's just PvP
Innocent doesn't want to be killed. Reporting the crime does not stop the PK
BH wants to kill the mark

If there is no reason for the innocent to report it is less likely for them to do so.

 

This is why it's made symmetric through the use of territory. If you go over into opposing territories, you are considered (by them) having done something wrong. They can hunt you. The game can make some kind of "defend out territory" bounty. Aion was an example where as you killed people you showed up on the map for everyone to hunt.

But again, it's symmetric. One faction's bandit is the other's hero.

All of this eliminates the need for an "innocent" to die.

 

It always seems like you are assuming that there is some kind of predefined good guy's and bad guys. Or that there are groups and teams like playing an old fashioned game of "Risk".

With Open PvP we have so much more possibilities than that. I really hope we don't exist in a world that is a blown up version of Risk, where each player has his own armies, and territories etc.

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That said, We can indeed join guilds that may be at war with another guild, and also compete over which group maintains control over the control points etc. However what about the people who are just flagged for PvP, and are just mining resources, or solving a quest, and a guy (not affiliated with any guild, but is flagged for PvP like the miner is). He attacks the miner to steal his resources he is mining.

In such a case factions don't come into play at all if these two guys just flagged for Open PvP by means of the blessings of the oracle. For all intents and purposes both those guys are just playing SotA, but they have a PvP flag so they can legally fight other players with a PvP flag. The incentive for the PK was not faction related, it was only to rob the player of the resources he was mining.

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So it's fine to have factions. It's fine to have PvP goals. However goals and factions aren't PvP. Being flagged for PvP only should refer to the ability to be attack-able by another player or not. Wars have rules of engagement, and it is legal to attack an opponent engaged in a war, however if two people are just flagged for PvP that does not mean they should be allowed to LEGALLY kill another player. So attacking and killing a player without any legal right to do so should result in a murder count. So the Open PvP Justice system needs to look beyond just factions, and so called goals of PvP. It needs to take behavior towards others into account.

 

I just have to weight in here.... Surprise!

The monkeys cannot run the zoo; the inmates cannot run the asylum; the players cannot police the game.

Too many opportunities for abusing authority. Too many problems arise and too many people will inevitably complain.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

the players policed the game in UO. I'm not asking for anything more than that.


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However if there was a court system, that would be cool, but we already had a bunch of threads on that a long while back, and a lot of us already voiced our opinions about it back then.

For me there should be no punishments that ruin the fun for the player, like being thrown in a jail cell (without the ability to escape, kill the guards and acquire your stuff again type scenarios).

 

Another reason I left the game.

But it's OK for the player who is the criminal to ruin the fun of the player who was the victim?

 

Aye it was a lot of fun chasing the bad guys.

 

The reason I like to be the target is so that the other player goes evil or red which means the blue can now kill them.
And if the PK pays the bounty how is it exploited?

 

Well with a choice you dont have to be a victim! that slider bar thing will keep you safe!

 

In Shroud of the Avatar, you're correct. However, Isaiah (the Avatar to whom I was speaking) was not speaking of SotA, but Ultima Online.

 

Well you actually did if you stayed in Trammel, it was safe there, but yes prior to tram you had to live on the edge! i like you died way too much, but i just made friends and got better then attacked the pkr (by the way if you want a private conversation with one Avatar, dont post in open forums, message him!) I am speaking to all Avatars here in public forums.