[Poll] If there were substantial changes would you do it?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Antrax Artek, Jun 24, 2019.

?

Would you do PVP if there were changes to make it meaningful, rewarding and less punitive for all?

Poll closed Jul 8, 2019.
  1. Yes

    47.0%
  2. I already do it

    5.9%
  3. No

    47.0%
  1. Lars vonDrachental

    Lars vonDrachental Avatar

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    I activated one time PvP of my own volition and that was during the Travian Quest in Aerie as it was mentioned that PvP has to be active if you want to defeat the evil.
    Don’t misunderstand me I visited this event in anticipation of being killed by followers of the obsidian order but the whole castle was a gout of flames and meteoroids and even if you managed to escape them you were immediately hunted down.
    And after continuously dying without the possibility of getting close to the plot action I end up naked in the gutter of Aerie castle as with every death another part of my gear/inventory was looted.
    That is basically my experience in SotA with PvP and as you might assume that is nothing I wish to repeat but as I'm not generally against PvP I voted "Yes". ;)

    I would like to add some ideas that might be interesting out of my perspective to join PvP again.
    My suggestion would be to at least implement 2 factions like “The Obsidian Order Recruits” and “The Lord British Militia” but I think it would be better if there would be some more factions…maybe one faction for each Dev with the Devs as leader?
    Within the factions there is no PvP aside of duels and in faction fight all members of one faction are handled as if they would be in one large group…so no friendly fire.

    With just two factions I would suggest continuously war between these two but if there are more factions I would suggest the implementation of a more complicated mechanic. E.g. that each NPC town can be assigned to a faction in a capture the flag kind of way. For example in each town are 3 flags and you can change their colors to your faction and if all flags have the same color for some time the town is changing to the new faction. Resulting in more or less just visible changes like e.g. the guards gear/heraldry is changing...but maybe also let the guards help the ruling faction in fights and yes that might mean that you cannot travel save in some towns and you have to watch the guards patrols.
    PoT owners might be able to decide on their own free will if the PoT should join a specific faction or not. Again just resulting in mostly visual changes like guards gear.

    Additionally I would suggest that with multiple factions these are not in continuous war and instead there are story related changes that result in war or peace between factions but we avatars have no real influence on…as if they would be medieval kingdoms and the factions leaders (alias kings alias devs) are deciding out of their own reasons to fight or to stop fighting.

    Maybe even the ransom could be just used in PvP combat scenes. Instead the participation in faction activities is granting “faction coins” or something similar as rewards and only these can be looted in faction fights. (e.g. 10% of the victims faction coins will be looted)
    These factions points have no weight, cannot be stored and they can be used more or less just for purchases at special vendors to get faction patterns, decorations and similar stuff and I think these bought items should be even account bound.
    These factions coins might be for all factions the same but maybe they should be different. In that case you might have to exchange the looted factions coins before you can use them at your factions vendor or you try to do a purchase at the vendor of a different faction e.g. to get a heraldry cloak of an opposing faction to camouflage yourself.

    Changing your faction might result in e.g. headhunter quests just available in the left fraction or a temporary vendetta-buff (e.g. 48h of played time) and as long as this buff is active on death you lose 20% of your fraction coins instead of 10% or ...
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2019
  2. Violet Ronso

    Violet Ronso Avatar

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    For me, PvP has always needed to be a side effect of another activity I've said this countless times throughout countless PvP threads on these forums, but the PvP model I've enjoyed the most across all games has always been Elder Scrolls Onlines Imperial city, where I was killing mobs, chasing treasure chests, and gathering resources, all while gathering a special currency that a % would drop on death: if you died to a mob, it simply dissapeared, if you died to a player, that was his reward for killing you. This allowed me to have something to do, fighting to gather resources or exp at a VERY COMPETITIVE rate, while having the thrill of a fight at any moment.

    Currently in Shroud I need to offer up my gear as a reward, and to get a competitive exp rate, I need to flag myself into zones that I can do without being flagged. I've always felt as there was nothing extra in PvP zones, they do feel special, but the only thing special about them in the end is how far away everything is from everything else, and how low the exp/resources rates can get. Also, I need to start wearing throwaway gear just to get started into PvP and try it.

    I am not a fan of 1v1 organized PvP, I dont like tournaments or anything, what I like is being able to use the environment, use the mobs and the map to my advantage. Imperial city had there super powerful bosses roaming the Imperial city sewers that would destroy a team of unprepared people, or people that weren't paying attention enough, and this would make 1vX fights a possibility, but a tactical one



    Here is an example of what 1vX fights looked like, always surrounded by mobs, using those to the players advantage. That is what would get me into PvP.

    (Ohh and side note, look how long the fights can carry on, most fights are a result of either resource management (Mana/Stamina in ESOs case), good crowd control usage (Stuns, interrupts, knockdowns) and terrain, there was no one shotting, You could 1 combo a person, but you had to get a perfect combo on an unaware person. THAT made for fun PvP, not just "land a lucky hit" or who will hit the hardest the fastest.
     
  3. Fenrus MacRath

    Fenrus MacRath Avatar

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    I PVP somtimes. My biggest hripe is the huge build disparity between PVE ( which is my primary focus) and PVP. What works against mobs is meaningless players and vice versa. Under the current system, if I wanted to PVP, I wouldn't do it here. There are hundreds of games way better suited for it. What would be cool, is some battle grond games like WOW used to have. They were really fun. Just a thought.
     
  4. Antrax Artek

    Antrax Artek Avatar

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    Because of the apparent incorrect behavior on the part of some, all the votes of those who do not have a minimum of 10 messages on the forum will not be counted in the main thread counter, but they will be visible anyway in the header counter.
    I will personally take care of counting poll results by excluding these in order to have a truthful result and not the mirror of those who have decided to tarnish public opinion through the limits unfortunately imposed by the forum software and multi-accounting.
    I take this opportunity to warmly thank those who have participated and continue to actively participate in the initiative.

    A few hours ago during the thread monitoring, different users detected and reported suspicious activity for what concerns the poll vote. Several accounts with 0 messages on forums 0 likes and 0 trophies voted the same option within minutes. For those interested, you can view these users directly by clicking on the result.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2019
  5. Violet Ronso

    Violet Ronso Avatar

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    Playing Devils advocate here, but these people seem to be users since 2018 or 2017 for the most part, why should we ignore the opinions of those who are simply less vocal? Unless you have evidence that this would be a planned attack or alternate accounts, why would you ignore their opinion?
     
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  6. Antrax Artek

    Antrax Artek Avatar

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    Oh but they will not be ignored, the poll result is clearly visible in the thread header, for the sake of truthfulness another counter is present in the main post where instead only those with more than 10 messages are counted.
    Anyone who will be able to see both and draw conclusions, no one will be censored, not even those who have apparently acted suspiciously.
     
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  7. Greyfox

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    SOTA PVP is a waste of development resources.

    The Unity engine isn't capable of supporting the timing and responsiveness for enjoyable PVP with the level of graphic resources required by SOTA.

    The SOTA Developers are not skilled enough and lack the bandwidth to effectively balance and manage effective and successful PVP within SOTA. Crowfall with a much larger, better funded, and experienced team developing a purely PVP focused game from the start are struggling immensely with PVP and Unity.

    Time and effort wasted on PVP have failed miserably. Continued efforts will just misappropriate already extremely limited funds and development efforts better used on implementing features such as Mounts which 'might' secure the future of SOTA.

    If you want fun PVP go play Mordhau or Chivalry.

    SOTA needs to focus like a laser 100% on PVE content to stand a chance.
     
  8. sotasota4

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    Isn't that what has been done since 2013? - It seems to me that the chances stand to zero ))
     
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  9. Greyfox

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    Quite a bit of effort was spent since 2013 on PVP content and balance.

    A very frequent Garriott quote, "80% of the quality of a game becomes visible in the last 20% of the development process." I'd estimate roughly 20% of development has been wasted on the PVP effort since 2013. Perhaps that's the MISSING 20% that could have polished PVE to have a successful game. Perhaps not?

    What I do know is PVP will never be what will drive SOTA to success.
     
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  10. Antrax Artek

    Antrax Artek Avatar

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    Albion Online (at the moment the #1 Sandbox PVP MMORPG) is made with unity and supports battles up to 200 vs 200 players without performance issues.
     
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  11. Greyfox

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    Indeed it does and look at the level of graphics. Stop with the false narratives.

    Albion Online is an Isometric 2D game. It's also 100% focused on PVP. Not a mishmash of dance parties, Barbie doll houses, half-assed quests, and a sprinkle of unbalanced ganking (SOTA pvp).
     
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  12. Antrax Artek

    Antrax Artek Avatar

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    I would invite you to check the information you have about 2D and isometric.

     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2019
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  13. Greyfox

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    The fact you think Albion Online has comparable graphics and responsiveness to SOTA tells me any further discussion with you is a wasted effort.

    My only concern is the future of SOTA having spent way too much effort, time, and money on this project.

    PVP will NEVER secure the future of SOTA. If the Developer(s) FINALLY reach the point of a successful PVE game, then in their spare time, push out some minimal PVP content, no problem. Otherwise it's a wasted effort.
     
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  14. Antrax Artek

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    I didn't say that the graphic is comparable to SOTA, i'm even pretty sure that none in this thread thought to bring 200 vs 200 battles here on SOTA.
    Simply your statement that unity is not good for pvp games is false, nothing more.
     
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  15. Joe Zhudarak

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    Working with scenes is really good for customized rules for the instances:
    SOTA can copy the hellgate system from Albion Onine for example, a gate entrance for a party of 2 or alone with full customized ranson rules, a final boss and chests with good rewards.


    Example:

    Blue gate entrance in Owl´s head: Rules: two entrances for solo players no ranson, tier 5 mobs and good reward chest;

    Yellow gate entrance in Shardfall and ruins: Rules two entrances for a party of 2 or alone, PVP zone ranson, tier 7 mobs and a very good reward chest;

    Red gate entrance: The fall and obsidian trials: Rules two entrances for a party of 2 or alone, Full Loot PVP, tier 8 mobs and a great reward chest;


    Its not that hard to implement, we already have templates and the basis for this with player made dungeons.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2019
  16. Greyfox

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    I suggest you simply read my statement regarding Unity and SOTA again:

    "The Unity engine isn't capable of supporting the timing and responsiveness for enjoyable PVP with the level of graphic resources required by SOTA."

    Enough with false narratives.
     
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  17. Dhanas

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    That would be definitely Amazing and easy to apply in sota cause we already have the tech for it ( i think so) .
    It can also give a reason to pvp ( loot in this case ) and allow pvers to cooheparate with pvpers and introduce them to a new ( optional ) PvP/PvE content.
     
  18. sotasota4

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    "The Unity engine isn't capable of supporting the timing and responsiveness for enjoyable PVP with the level of graphic resources required by SOTA." <--- FALSE NARRATIVE

    PLEASE "Enough with false narratives" ))
     
  19. Mylady ‘Gin Gin Darlin

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    “The Unity engine isn't capable of supporting the timing and responsiveness for enjoyable PVP with the level of graphic resources required by SOTA.”

    So by that statement equally SotA can never support being a large scale massive multiplayer online game? So therefore if SotA can’t handle a large PvP battle then equally it will never cut it as a MMO.

    “SOTA PVP is a waste of development resources.”

    That seems like something someone who has a hatred for PvP would say. I’m sure the PvP crowd would state otherwise.

    It’s clear that the market out there in the gaming world for PvP is huge and still very profitable. I’m not a PvP player myself, but I disagree that PvP is a waste of development resources. It’s difficult to get a fair balance of PvE and PvP in a game, but it’s not impossible. Why not have a place for the PvPers to duke it out that has great mechanics whilst also bringing in more story and environment for the PvEers?

    “The SOTA Developers are not skilled enough and lack the bandwidth to effectively balance and manage effective and successful PVP within SOTA.”

    @Chris, what do you think?

    “My only concern is the future of SOTA having spent way too much effort, time, and money on this project. “

    The same could be said for all the “mishmash of dance parties, Barbie doll houses” as you put it.

    “PVP will NEVER secure the future of SOTA.“

    You can’t know that. Equally if they did invest the time into making a full fledged engaging, fun, competitive PvP by taking some of the successful mechanics from other games, it could be a life line for SotA that could then allow them to concentrate on the PvE aspects.
     
  20. Greyfox

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    I'd love @Chris input. I'm tired of seeing time wasted on PVP in SOTA without fruition.
     
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