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Scout quest for arcane catalysts now one per day !!!!! - REVERT

Discussion in 'Release 54 QA Feedback Forum' started by Anvar, May 28, 2018.

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  1. Ryodin Stormwind

    Ryodin Stormwind Avatar

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    From the Release 54 Post rough draft:

    Arcane Catalysts: We have adjusted the Scout quest in the Sieges so that the Arcane Catalysts can only be turned in once per day. To balance this limit we have increased the required catalysts to 18 and the reward to 12,000 XP. Note this quest previously had no daily limit and therefore was being used for leveling exploits.

    Honestly... How is this a leveling exploit when you can't even hit the experience per hour cap doing this unless you save up for days or more, which still averages out to under the cap...
     
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  2. Barugon

    Barugon Avatar

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    I believe the problem lies in that they have anti-exploit code in place that will automatically suspend an account if a certain amount of gold is generated within a specific time frame. Saving up a large amount of Arcane Catalyst and then turning it all in will trigger this protection.
     
  3. Asti

    Asti Avatar

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    I don't understand this "solution" at all.

    You add a repeatable quest to the game, that pretty clearly people have been enjoying.
    People start doing the repeatable quest.
    You change the quest so they can't turn it in more than once per day because... people are doing the quest over and over.
     
  4. TheGrinch

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    This makes no sense to me. Are you planning to also limit the amount of ore that a person can farm during a day? Are you planning to limit the amount of ore that a person can turn into ingots during a day? Or wood into boards? Or cotton into spools, or spools into cloth? People have been buying ore, wood and cotton for a month (some with real life money) to stockpile it for this double xp crafting event. Some people have 10's of thousands of these mats stockpiled to do the xp event with. Now a few resourceful people had the insight to go out and put in work to kill siege engineers and managed to stockpile some catalysts and along comes someone with the Nerf Hammer and the ban stick because oh, whoa is me the crafters are bitching that someone figured out a way to gain crafting xp by killing things. Leave the sieges and the catalyst quest the way they are now. People have worked hard for the reward that they deserve, you cant snatch it away from them unless you plan to snatch it away from everyone who stockpiled ANYTHING for the event.
     
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  5. Shaylee

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    Take away or drastically modify interactions that make the game fun and eliminate the purpose of the quest. There isn't THAT much money to be made, Sieges aren't that quick to do. It would make more sense to gradually increase the turn in amount (i.e., from 6 to 8 to 10 and so on), and decrease the amount of gold and experience rewarded, it would then become a quest of diminishing returns, rather than a one and done for the day. ESPECIALLY when other quest lines are dependent on completion of Sieges. *shakes my head* Anyone teaching a Frustration 101 Class ?
     
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  6. Sir Aular Glorthalion

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    This change sounds like you expect people to do, at most, 1 siege per day. Kill 18 engineers, get 18 catalysts, turn that in - done for the day. Try to find ways to skip all the siege load screens afterward.

    Not a very elegant solution.

    Perhaps you could make the first turn-in of 18 catalysts your 12K EXP and subsequent turn-ins on the same day at something less, like 3K? And the experience generated per hour does not seem to mathematically compare to what one can earn in Lost Vale in a good group doing cabalists or hitting a control point.
     
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  7. Elwyn

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    Isn't this a quest turn-in? Then you would get the same amount of producer XP as well. Try getting that from the monkey room.
     
  8. Ryodin Stormwind

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    Sure, you get producer experience from the quest - 3000 per turn in. It takes me at AL 85 about 15-20 minutes to defeat all the siege engineers in the scene. I'm sure others are able to do it much faster, and that is probably the problem here. I'm guessing people are getting it done in ~5 minutes somehow, leaving the siege without bothering with the cabalist, and moving to the next siege. But there is going to be downtime moving between sieges. There's no way to reset the current siege to get all the siege engineers back that I know of short of defeating the cabalist(s). I can't imagine people are amassing more than 12 turn-ins (4 sieges - 3 per siege) per hour. Even that would be an insane pace. That would be 12 x 3000 = 36,000 xp per hour. Maybe if they did something like have a friend find the next siege to create a teleport point, but even then - let's even say you double the amount - you're only looking at 72,000 xp per hour.

    Let's compare this to mining in the Elysium Mines for the same amount of time for example. You get 500xp per successfully mined node. If I mine ~350 ore per hour (fairly typical, though I get closer to 400), and get 1.75 ore per node we will say (1-3 ore per node), then that would amount to: 350 / 1.75 = 200 nodes per hour. 200 * 500 xp = 100,000 xp per hour. Even if your mining numbers are far more conservative, you are going to get way more producer experience for the time spent mining in a proper mine than farming sieges.

    *For a conservative mining example. Let's say I'm actually getting closer to 2.25 ore per node, and only 300 ore per hour. That's still 133 nodes in an hour. 133 * 500 xp = 66,500 xp per hour. Nearly double what you could get from sieges with the same time investment.


    Point is that just because you also are getting producer experience still doesn't make this a broken game play element. It's an alternative way to get a respectable amount of producer exp without endlessly grinding mining nodes.

    If the designer is concerned about producer experience, there are many good alternatives to what has been implemented:
    • Make the quest system allow for rewards of adventure or producer specific experience.
    • Diminishing returns the more turn-ins per day.
    • Limit how many catalysts can be held in inventory at one time.
    • Decrease the amount of experience earned.
    Any of these would be better than restricting the quest to only be done once per day.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2018
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  9. Nikko

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    So perfectly stated. This was at least a FUN way to get a fairly good amount of producer XP without mining for hours. (and like he said, it doesn't even get you close to the amount you CAN get in a mine!) I just don't get it. Every time there is something fun, that seems worthwhile, it is taken and smashed. This is supposed to be fun...
     
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  10. Rat2

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    I think that's the point. It is way more fun to do sieges with other people than it is to mine and you get a considerable amount of resources from the engineers. No fun for you! o_O
     
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  11. mystarr

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    @DarkStarr @Lum the Mad

    Any chance the "cooldown" on this quest could be set to a shorter time period?
    Maybe once per Novian day? (1hr)


    This should prevent players from running into issues with the auto ban bots while still giving players an incentive to fight through sieges more often.

    A stated by others in this thread, a turn in rate of one siege quest per hour would not be out of balance with the earn rate from other activities in game (and as icing, it makes more "in game" sense to base the timer on game time instead of real world time.)
     
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  12. Sir Leonard

    Sir Leonard Localization Team

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    Not to make any statement but i go the impression that they are thinking exactly of how to do this yet. And as for the day, i think it was already the "britanian day". Anyway...
     
  13. Anvar

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    No it isnt a britannian day, I mentioned it earlier in thread that the scout seems to be breaking lore and know about our time as when he says tomorrow he does not mean tomorrow in novia, I handed in at the end of a novian day on QA then waited over 24 hrs as it wouldnt hand in the next day so I actually waited for the following day, still wouldnt hand in so I checked another siege. I havent waited 24hrs our time cus I cba but Im sure thats what it is.
     
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  14. Drake Aedus

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    It's kind of funny really... the repeatable quest mechanic was created as a stop-gap for lack of content in the game. One of those game loops to make the world more interesting, if I remember correctly?

    I guess we're just not supposed to go into very many sieges in the eyes of Portalarium?
     
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  15. Sir Leonard

    Sir Leonard Localization Team

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    Yeah I see but since it is QA you must consider this to also be a bug and be at an “unpolished” state.
     
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