Subterfuge Skills

Hello,

I'm providing feedback regarding Subterfuge Skills.

I am AV Level 79.
No buffs/enhancement gear:
STR: 74
DEX: 63
INT: 50

Distract
Does this skill have a purpose? Anyone? The only thing it has ever distracted was me - when I tried to use the skill.

Engage Opponent
Does this skill have a purpose? Anyone? I've not even bothered leveling this skill as it seems useless to me when I have sprint/dash at my disposal.

Sneak Attack
This skill needs some refinement in a major way. At level 76 Sneak Attack provides a "robust" (sarcasm) damage of 9-25. Thrust on the other hand... starts at 23 damage and tops out at 64. Are these values reversed? Sneak attack is pretty useless with such little damage.

In checking - every single blade skill does more damage than sneak attack.

In my opinion Sneak Attack should require the following:
1. Light Armor
2. Dual Wielding
3. Behind target

Once implemented, I think that the damage needs to be increased by 3x or 4x - at least. Right now there is no incentive at all to level this skill. For 4 more focus I can do triple the damage with thrust.


Sap
This skill also needs refinement. At level 56 I am under 30% chance to stun. Per the tool tip at 76 the chance is 38%.

Trip, on the other hand - at level 48 has a 62% chance of knocking the enemy down. Per the doll at 68, it's a 67% chance to trip.

In my opinion Sap should require the following:
1. Light Armor
2. Behind target


Train Dexterity
My skill level is 80. I have 63 dex overall and I wind up with a 2% avoid (ability to dodge per the doll) I think it's pretty apparent what's wrong here.

If I'm toting light armor (a full set mind you) with a high dex I would hope to see a higher ability to dodge an attack. Sadly, this is not the case. Dodge skill does almost nothing for me.


Thank you for reading.

~ Romaan Sebulska

 

Not that it's obvious in any way, but avoidance and the dodge you get from dex are different stats entirely. AFAIK there's nothing obvious as to how Dex affects your overall *damage mitigation* because the formula for those things require the enemies dex as well.

I *think* the paltry damage you're seeing for sneak attack is if you used it from the front of a mob. I know it does way the hell more damage than what it's saying when you attack from behind.

 

Hey another one who thinks Subterfuge is a useless pile of garbage! Welcome aboard! I've been mirroring this sort of feedback for a looooong time now!

Distract is garbage. Even if you get it to work, the effect will never be long enough for you to make practical use for it.

You can use it without breaking stealth so it's actually pretty nifty. In combat, I usually use it to rush Mages and Archers and the speed (at least for me) is WAY faster than sprint and dash... the difference is like going to warp speed.

You can also crit for zero damage!

I highly disagree; more specifically on the dual wielding part. I shouldn't need to hold two blades to put a blade inside someone's back... or to cut someone's throat. Backstabs should require a lot of force.

What really needs to be enforced is how armour should influence stealth. As far as I can tell, heavy armour has no penalty on stealth.

And the sad part is that I don't think Dodge helps that much either.

 

Engage also has much better range than any other charging skill at high level.

 

I want to see what combos they make with this..

 

From what I understand from one of the Tech Talks, @Chris said that Dex isnt working that way right now and he needs to work on the math. Apparently once skills get high enough, the enemy has a 100% chance to hit you no matter your dex.

Around the 24 minute mark.

 

In my mind... and maybe I'm being too liberal here... but if I'm rocking a full set of light armor and have a high dex... (talking 50+) I should (again in my crazy mind) be dodging about 20% of the time out of the gate with no buffs.

I'll go even further and say that heavy armor should prevent you from dodging. You're in heavy armor... how much dodging can you actually do? Your goal should be damage reduction/mitigation, not dodging.

@Gix - Ok so after some thought... ya I can get what you mean about not liking a forced dual wield to be able to backstab. I'll revise... I think you should be required to use a short weapon (Dagger, short sword); Longsword, 2H sword should not apply for backstab. You get enough crit+ on those as it is... give some incentive for dagger/short weapon use.

 

I have over 150 Dex and I dont really any benefit to defense. Stacking Avoid and Dodge though makes a world of difference.

 

150 dex?!! Sir I need education.

 

What is the difference between tripping and stunning?

Does this game have attacks of opportunity if something tries to get up from a threatened area?

 

That's not a crit. That's an insult!

 

Tripping just knocks the mob down... they get right back up but it gives you about 4-5 good whacks at a target with very little defense.

Stuns last for a while... and if you can actually get a target stunned you usually will get a crit out of it. But when I do... it's with Thrust... not backstab.

 

I use [Trip] as often as I can because it can (sometimes) allow me to run behind them and get a backstab. Gotta be quick, though. However, a lot of the time, the mob will just auto-face you like a turret while it's on the ground so a backstab isn't always possible.

Last time I checked, [Trip] overrides any stuns an enemy might have so it's not the greatest for group play.