Well Grounded, Blue Blooded, and Fire proof

@PrimeRib "Grind to win" is not desirable, I grant. But there must be some middle ground before we get all the way to static characters that come into play as strong as they will ever be. I think a raw recruit just out of basic should get owned comically by a special forces soldier who has seen many tours of active duty. Just as in any other profession, experience makes us better, considerably so. The other day I saw a doctor, a surgeon skilled and knowledgeable, have to call on another physician who was more experienced to finish her procedure. He knew the technique better because he'd been performing it far longer, simple as that.

I don't think that this kind of game should reward mindless grinding, but without SOME sort of progression, why bother to try? If my character cannot be improved, then it is reduced to a chess piece, always having exactly the same potential and ability, worthy of note only when tested against an opposing force, in which exchange it is likely expended. Then raised from death, replaced with identical ability and value, it waits for the next battle. I don't want to play a chess piece.

 

The early Ultima games were pretty fun with combat, despite the fact it followed the same formula where you had to find and defeat monsters to gain advancements. Combat sort of only started feeling grindy when strategy in melee started being a non-issue and it was just about clicking the enemy repeatedly. All they have to do, imo, is make sure combat is not just about repeatedly clicking a mouse button. Same thing with crafting.

 

Good point. However these gains must be really slow after a while. I would hate it if anybody could get every skill in the game. If that is possible it better take years. Also there's PvP to be concerned about. I wouldn't want them to only force people of the same level to meet up, so if you've played more than others and are level 500 and most people are level 50 then you see nobody in PvP. Either that or the person can get to level 500 and he would then have an advantage over the player that couldn't spend that many hours playing. Then all vets have a huge advantage over regular players too.

 

Here is the problem, kid gamers in asia can cost as little as $5/hr. So no matter how slow it is, I'm sure with a couple days of investment, you can get some fairly high skills from them. But its a delema.

 

if there's some kind of skill cap then at least we can be assured that we won't be at a disadvantage against a grinder. They might reach the cap first but that's about it.

 

Child gamers in Asia will ALSO rip everything worth having out of your account and sell it for real gold, leaving you broke and deleted with a new level one named SukIt. So that little paranoid fantasy resolves itself.

A cap on what you can APPLY would be of much more interest to me than a cap on what you can LEARN. There are only so many buttons, and I only have so much time in a fight. It doesn't actually help me if I know eighty-six different fire spells, if each one has to be cast seperately, and you have protection from fire. Efficiency is a big deal in combat, whether PvP or PvE. Even PvTD.

 

What if a fire mage fights against another firemage? They will both have resistance to fire. Don't you think that one might be able to kill another? Of course they will. It will probably grant you a better chance to resist or take half damage from such spells. It doubt it makes you immune to fire.

Using UO as an example (again) in the early days the Magic Resistance skill determined your ability to resist spells. If you resisted you took only half damage, or you would completely resist a hold person type spell. If you had GM Magic Resistance 100skill points vs a GM mage 100 skill points you had a 50/50 chance to take half damage from direct damage spells. AND THAT WAS AGAINST ALL FORMS OF MAGIC. Even then mages were very dangerous. Magic resistance was a more difficult skill to master too. It wasn't easy to become a GM of Magic resistance, but even if you did it didn't make magic useless. Mages could still burn you down in like 3 or 4 spells max. There was a lot of running out of the mage's distance, and back in again (at least for me).

 

If two fire mages fight, and neither one was smart enough to diversify even just a little, it will still be decided by who has better efficiency of action, not who knows more spells. The guy who knows the RIGHT spells, and uses them correctly, will win. Running in and out, using heals, resisting, throwing a banana at him...It isn't important how many options there are, it matters which one you USE. Efficiency, not scope. Now, when you talk about being able to deal with multiple situations, unusual challenges, THEN scope will do quite well for you. For some PvP fights, though, having two hundred different choices available is almost a bad thing.

 

Yes, that would help. One of the greatest under rated features in UO was that it was less about how high your skills were;and it was more about how well the combination of skills you chose compliment your play style. Loved that.

Yeah but in the years of using the WoW power leveling I never had that problem. You mostly just need to jump on google... find a provider... then search the providers name on google and see if they any negative reviews.

What you described is how UO handled it. I thought that in itself was revolutionary. Making it about your skill combination over how high the skill was.

 

Good points. I think a good mix of passive skills and active skills are good. To many skills you have to activate leads to confusion.

 

Yeah, actually, I wouldn't know. I level my own toons.

 

Alright. Well you commented on it so if thought maybe you knew. So you were just theorizing, or making stuff up about Asian children stealing?

 

Nah, I was just reporting what I've been TOLD. I didn't know I was in the presence of a power leveling connoisseur.

 

I think as a warrior you'll find you want some of those skills in earth magic for strength and wind magic for dex and some of the bonuses they give you. then you'll also get your preffered combat tree, say blades which will likely have some combos that work with the magic skill trees, and most people will get some form of armor combat trees. If you want to be a pure warrior I have a feeling you wont be as powerful as if you took on some magic. Keep in mind we have HP and focus, you use focus for all moves whether it's magical or not. so most people will likely want to find a good balance between str/dex/int, and if you don't take the deeper magic and just keep it on the top magic abilities and innates you probably wont need a lot of Int. I expect the combat skills will use little focus while things like summon demon will use a lot.

 

you don't think there might be some extra skills laying around to gain some magic after you've maxed out a weapon, armor, and shield tree? There should be enough to get weapon, armor, shield, and the earth magic innate skills I would hope!

So that's about 4 different skill trees maxed out most likely. What if a person decides to drop shields all together and spends them on weapon, armor, earth magic, and a little sun and a little moon???? or how about they drop shields and do weapon, armor, some earth, and the electrical, fire, and cold resistances?

All of those would make powerful warriors. I'm thinking what if somebody decides to role play a mage hunter character? Say he hates mages because a mage set fire to his BMW and he holds a grudge. So the guy drops the shield skills and picks up only the elemental resistance skills instead, and he uses a two handed sword, or a war hammer, or a halberd.

 

I just love all the options we have with this open classless system. I can't wait to dig into it and see what builds we can come up with.

 

you got that right! I've been looking into these skill trees the devs came up with and I see so many different combinations that lead to good characters. Maybe the mage hunter with a two handed weapon might be more vulnerable to other warriors, but against mages it won't matter if you have a shield so why not???

There's lots of options in this game, and it's still early on. I'm sure they will add more skills later. I can see why they are spending so much time trying to make things balanced, because there are just so many options for good character paths!