Why Bother Playing Anything?

Its satisfying to sell gear and be a devoted crafter, in whats advertised as a player run economy. Perhaps realize that while you view it as competition, others look at it like simply playing the game.

It baffles me that the majority of players on these forums are so focused in defending the current setup, and convincing themselvs that it will appeal to evrryone, instead of actually feedback and testing to make it appealing to all audiences instead of their small isolated market of RP ers, in a game clearly aiming to be more Mmo friendly.

 

BOOM SHAKALAKA!

 

And so... Because this one person exists, are you saying that ruins the game for all the tens of thousands who might play in the future?

Do you see a solution to these concerns?

The topic of the thread is why bother playing. Why do you play SotA?

 

Im meerly stating that currently where the bar is for a new player to come in and be a *crafter thats up to par* in a system that .. if i have 100 ore, 100 silver, and the fuels.. (both crafters use the same amount of materials) to create one item that is superior to the other. This means that ( as i stated ) for someone who wants to come in and be a COMPETITIVE crafter, that time/gap is already massive. And all evidence points that its only going to get larger as MORE EO access players hit that point.
( Are you going to pay someone 1000g to make you that +8 bow with 10% dmg.. or are you going to pay someone 1000g to make you that +8 bow, 2x the break chance for +5% dmg? )


Im meerly stating this makes it INCREDIBLY unappealing for new players coming in. Especialy if the option is *wait till your competition moves on to another game* as stated in a previous post.

So does this ruin the game for tens of thousands who might play ? No. It simply prevents some from playing in the first place. Which is kind of why i referd to the free trials, and the sources OUTSIDE of the official forums, for the glaring and obvious issue of SOTAs lack of attraction to new players.

Do i have solutions for these concerns? Some? Ive been throwing out suggestions for 6 months of IMO ways to adjust to make it more appealing for players starting today, or more importantly, 6 months from now. I've been activly pushing the idea that people should think on productive feedback to make the game more appealing to casual players, and ways to implement mechanics that do this, without directly nerfing the people who have put the time in.

My Problem here, is that the GENERAL attitutde of these forums, seems to be ( read this thread ) , Oh its hard? Oh you dont have the time to put in? Too bad.
And it shows in sources OUTSIDE of the official forums that this makes the game even more unappealing.

So why do i play SOTA?
Thats a good question. For a while it was simply to stay at least in range of the curve of other EO access players for the hope that decent guild wars mechnics will be announced, and i wont have to play so much catchup.
Now its more just to pay the taxes on my deeds as i slowly grow more and more impatient at the idea that they still wont elaborate on their actual plans regardding this. And even going so far as to ignore threads they requested we open on the specific topics.

I still play SOTA solely for the group of people i brought INTO the game, and are still enjoying for the most part.. although the numbers are starting to dwindle as one can expect, for games that.. simply put, do it better.

And since im here, and since id still very much like to see SOTA actually appeal to more people, and be successful, i have no problem pointing out that there ARE issues that should be addressed, and that shrugging your shoulders and thinking the game is doing everything right, isnt enough. And i feel id rather sit here and post my concerns, my experiances, and what i see happening that might prevent that, as opposed to being one of the people pouting on reddit. (despite the sheer number of people who have blatently given up trying to point out issues on here, and have either quit the forums, or quit the game )

So yes. I think 1 person having that much crafting power ALREADY, severly hurts the game.
Yes i think that players able to FARM BOSSES and crush the rarity for items is hurting the game.
NO i dont think players should be punished for having more time and effort putting into the game.
Yes i think there is and can be mechanics to appease both ends of the spectrum.
NO i have not seen dev's make a real statement or show their plan regardding, well any of this.
Yes my confidence IS waning on the devs actually elaborating on making guild wars ( the only PVP besides dueling i ever see being mentionable in this game ).


Lastly - The most positive thing that i have heard come from them in a while was the idea that they REALIZE theres a power gap, and they are entertaining ideas of allowing you to pick a specilized skill in 1 of the trees. So while staying CLASSLESS, it adds a tad of group dynamic and synergy overall.
This is a great example of a solution to a glaring problem, and im hoping they elaborate more on it, as YOU might not realize or see it as an issue. I do.

Unfounded assumptions?
Lol.

So wouldnt answering some of the glaring problems that might prevent new players from starting in sota.. be considered something they should look at for improving the game?

Were supposed to be less then 6 months from release. The appeal for new players to start this game SHOULD BE A MAJOR CONCERN. And im simply listing reasons why i have guildies start and leave, ive had RL players start and quit laughing.. and why i cant get a good chunk of people to touch this game.
Not to mention the obvious complaints on sources outside of this forum. Its stuff the community should be discussing solutions for that helps both end of the spectrum, and that is do able by the devs.
As opposed to assuming everyone else's concerns, complaints and blatent issues with the game are *unfounded.. lol..
Or better yet .. trying to blame the problems, or concerns other players have with * Its your own fault for being competitive! * ... in a video game.. where.. entertainment/competition is the main goal for a VERY large amount of people.

 

@MrBlight

Wholely agreed.

I too, am more concerned with the reasons why SotA finds it hard to get new players, and if it will continue to be a problem come launch etc, than how this game personally affects my play sessions etc.

I'll not continue to repeat what has been written in this thread, but will emphasize the dread of an empty world with numerous barren POTs, towns and cities, with the already limited population segregated in different play modes.

A good game for the masses needs to be fun, and have as little barrier to entry as possible; of course without losing its main vision.

Great lore comes in handy, helps with immersion, meaning and RP; giving new players a reason to stay. Sadly, I've yet to see it being implemented much in SotA despite its inherent scope for epic celestial story-lines.

A sandbox game does have a steeper learning curve than most themes boxes. It doesn't need to compound that with un-intuitive gameplay and lack of a backdrop, making one's actions meaningless.

 

i do feal biggest thing to make in this game now is to make sure the new players stay by not helping new players the game just die
need ways for players to stay and have fun and maby a program or to for othere players to get involved in the new player helping

one way would be cheap and cost dev nothing like 10% xp gain in party with a char thats fresh or under a sertan lvl
othere system i am sure we all can debate but just look around at othere games that make sure new players live on in the game they do stuff for it nothing comes for free
you can do all kinda stuff realy from dropping stuff for both players to enhance the exsperience for both
or like in uo lets not forget this each new player got a deed for a reward in game to get them to go try find othere players to get there priz
now as long as them rewards are wanted in game by the remaining players not only get the new player a lump of gold but they get to talk to some stranger they never seen befor

i personaly feal that new players need enhansed help by both the game from start and help from othere players and this shood be the main focus to 1 make sure they injoy the game and 2 dont quit after they leave new player area

befor you all cry out this helpfull stuff can be abused and so on i say even if thats is so theres still a motivation for helpfull souls to be even more helpfull so just get more peple motivated and this game will be allright

 

I get the impression the word masses absolutely terrifies some people here. When reading posts from, I guess you would call them the supporters no matter what crowd, it almost feels as though they don't want this game to be really successful. Their own narrow view of what the game should be, even when this view has not been backed up by the devs, is all consuming for them and nothing else will do. Even very sensible and logical suggestions for the good of the game, put across in the right way, can get shot down because it doesn't fit in with this narrow view. It's a real shame but also not unusual, you see it in all MMO's at this point. The sad thing is that those MMO's who follow the narrow path to appease end up very niche and ultimately dead.

There are a number of things the game could be doing to make it more appealing to new players and to give people a reason to give positives as to why they play. A wipe and proper retail release for example seems such a logical thing to do it almost jumps up and down while burning as brightly as the Sun screaming at the top of its voice. Less fuss, RNG and grinding for the crafting skills. Lore that spreads out across all scenes (why are the scenes there, what are they all about, what's the scenes story)? Give simplified options to some systems like resists, combat decks, character progression, crafting etc just so the option is there if someone wants less complex gameplay. I understand some players push against these things but for the good of the game, rather than personal wants, options for players is a good thing.

The devs seem to be looking at some of these things so hopefully we get more options to appeal to more players.

 

That happens sometimes, but I don't think that's the case here. The game needs to be balanced so that players progress more slowly; this is just part of the development and/or tuning process. Some players are in a panic about it, but I disagree...

I agree with a lot of these suggestions! The static combat decks (simpler than unlocked) are getting some love in release 42, so hopefully that will make them more viable. I also agree that a full wipe would be a very healthy thing to do, but for many reasons, this will not happen. I hope there is at least a skill/XP rollback (fully within the rights of the developers to do, no matter how much crying would ensue...).

 

I agree with @mercster on these things, but especially with this one below;

If all our players were accelerated, this would still lead to where we are now, where waiting for content to challenge these high-end players think about it... "why are we not filled with all these players who have been with us so long?"

I believe It's because the mundane living environment skills surrounding all it's worldly qualities are not enough to sustain the entertainment value, because Portalarium has withheld such content while not being able to keep up on the hunger of hunting, because the underlying supporting worldly content isn't there .... "yet" There's just not that much to do here yet. Our SOTA still remains in a holding pattern with restricted content.

Even if we keep adding new hunting grounds, as we have, those places become less hunted, the faster players can transition through them. With each new area, we see returning players come back, only to again leave once they have conquered it's content. Yet also, there's no amount of PvP content that can could bring players into our game, without supporting content as fishing, agriculture (which are almost always brought up in questions where Lord British is interviewed at places such as DragonCon) and other immersive worldly events. We are close to what we need, and some of this is being worked on, "but it's not here yet". I do have faith that such content will all be here someday, but I also believe that without exciting fishing and deeper agricultural content and skill, we will still be in a "end game" atmosphere, where once hunting grounds are conquered, "players will leave".

<Time Lord switches to emergency metaphor mode>

• Fish don't swim in the desert, unless they hibernate in dry lake beds waiting for water to come ...
• With only sand, only a desert seed can grow and thus be as a desert is, which is deserted ...
• SOTA is still a castle built on sand with no supporting rock for it's base to sit on ...
• A castle made of sand is always endangered of being blown or washed away ...
• A deserted desert makes a lousy place to put a Walmart store ...
• Without the ground, the grass doesn't grow ...

When is this supporting content suppose to come?

Until then, we're still left plowing in a desert
~Time Lord~

 

I was so disappointed to see fishing get pushed back completely out of this quarter But I understand the reality...they have had to refactor and keep iterating on more basic systems (surely longer than they thought, or really wanted to, but it's obviously necessary)...no use working on fishing when the combat is still a mess. Ah well.

 

If players would progress slower how can I play through the story without having to grind in between?
We should be able to complete the story by doing quest after quest. But if this progress is too fast, then how should it be slowed down without forcing people to constantly stop following the story and do other things in order to progress more slowly?

 

Again, I can't help but to agree. Yet I'll also say that combat will always need balancing until the end of... well... Time So let's just hope I keep hanging in there

Our other worldly (missing) content and skill trees should help these issues, but you are right about the quests. Our NPC's deeper lives haven't filled in enough blanks to help camouflage or enhance the questing experience. Our quest is in the same position as our hunting areas are, where once you've run through them, then they're done, or for now, come to their end to be later continued as development moves on. Our quest content in another "quickie" to me. I personally have been putting off all my questing, because I don't wish to end in frustration, which is where we all end up after the quickie content has been exhausted to it's end.

We call everything that is slow a grind, yet that's where worldly environment needs to fill in to keep that grind something that has more entertainment worth, through adding volume, through adding a richer soil or base to our game.

Until I can (side quest) date the farmer's daughter, or go cow tipping, I'm not going to be satisfied, but I'm still going to continue to play... and pray for the cookies to come.

Let's all keep praying for cookies !'

~Time Lord~

 

This is a curious concept...where is it written that people should be able to do quests with no "grinding"? What about people who don't like travelling at all? Just put all quest sources and objectives in one big room and let them hit each one, 10 feet from each other.

This is like playing PacMan and saying "I don't want to have to eat all these tiny pellets, I want them all to be Super Pellets!". I honestly don't understand...isn't grinding (aka "levelling up") part of the basic idea in most RPGs? Why should anyone be exempt from it? And no "I don't like levelling up" isn't an answer, because I would simply respond, play a game without character development or stats.

 

For me a story needs a flow. Like the adventures of a group of heroes in a good novel or in a movie. If I completed one quest, a new one should open up and I should be able to complete it.
Often there is some sense of urgency to a story. An undead army is invading the land. One city is next in line to be destroyed so we are sent on our way to retrieve the magical object which would protect the city. But instead of doing this, we grind a bit here in this area and then in that. Because the dungeon we have to enter is way too hard for us. All the while the undead army sits idle and waits for us to finish our grinding instead of attacking the town.
It is illogical and destroys the flow of the story.
So yes, I expect that I can do quest after quest in order to be able to enjoy the story without illogical interruptions that rip me out of the flow and out of the story.

 

@Jaanelle DeJure i forsee another moderation in the very near future

 

Agreed, confirms my long standing belief that the game is fine, significant sections of our user base is ruining it and the whole idea of allowing people into a game while its under development is a catastrophic failure.

The dev's should anly allow people to play in the game if they submit in the minimum 10 bugs a month and do a weekly write up and submit it of issues they have which need to be analyzed in whole (As data) by the dev's. That instead of the ranting on the forums.

 

that's the reason I won't buy any of my Thai friends this game yet. but I do have plans to do just that what the time seems right They love the graphics right now, but I still have to check their machines as well to see if their computers can handle it at the internet café.


Chances are, right now those computers won't ~TL~

 

Yes, yes and YES! I agree with everything you posted here @Pikegirl

To me, your point about the lack of game lore and epic storylines is the biggest problem with SotA. What made the Ultima games so great? The copious amounts of lore the player could delve into, combined with a compelling storyline that pulls in the player. SotA was marketed as having all this and "a bag a chips" but I have still yet to see it. Having said that, I am happy that the devs do seem to be listening and are implementing more lore and quests. The question is, will they be a virtue style dilemma? Or a go here kill a bear and bring me his pelt? Only time will tell...

 

Grinding is when what you do has no purpose other than some spreadsheet number. It is when Skyrim allowed you to spam a thousand daggers to qualify to make Daedric armor, before the devs nerfed it because they intended you to level by questing not by grinding (literally since it involved a grindstone!)

As far as where it is written that it shall be - how about the very front page of the SOTA kickstarter?

" Shroud of the Avatar is the first installment of Richard’s new vision and represents the reinvention of the classic, fantasy role-playing which he pioneered. A fantasy role-playing game that will focus more on player choices and discovery than on level grinding." In fact the kickstarter copy was so badly edited that those sentences appear twice in the same paragraph!

In other words it is OK to kill wolves as long as there is choice and consequence involved. Maybe you saved a farmers sheep. Maybe the furs kept a village warm in winter. Maybe they was attack dogs for your rival guild and started a war. All of that is way more interesting and fun to play than kill 10000 wolves to make the next level of the log curve.

 

"focus more"