Homesteading - Renting, Buying, Living on Grace, and More!

Heya friends,

This is an open forum to get some discussions rolling on how players will choose where they want to live. It seems like there are a lot of people who are concerned over Player Owned Towns and how their governors will wield their power; however, there are more concerns. People are concerned about location on the map (whether overland or connected to another town), aesthetics, their personal location in said towns, foot traffic for vendors, themes, Open PvP, and so forth. One of the big concerns many players have is, "How do I afford the plot?" This is where people get concerned by renting or buying rights, whether they will be gifted land, or so forth.

This poll and discussion are to assess player attitudes on renting (either paying in-game gold or real life currency). Thought provoking questions you may want to consider when putting up your initial opinions:

• What features do you consider necessary for your future homeland?
  
• If you don't like the idea of paying rent, under what circumstances would you change your mind (if there are any)?
• If you don't mind the idea of paying rent, what do you expect from governors and their towns?

When voting in the poll, please don't vote based on what you have available to you right now (such as those who already own land, have made arrangements with a governor of a player owned town, or plan to just hunt for NPC-owned, open plots). Please vote based on whether you would rent, and under what conditions, or if you would not rent.

I would prefer if this did not become a war zone about filthy capitalists abusing the little guys or rabble-rousing proletarians being whiners. This is a discussion (or hopefully, if people decide to bite and talk, haha). I will ask the mods to burn this whole house down on top of us if it becomes anything else.

Thank you, guys! Let's get this discussion rolling!

Sincerely,

Zap

**EDIT** I made a mistake on option 5 that reads "I will not rent from a Player Owned Town under any circumstances." Please do not use this option. The corrected option is option 6: "I will not being living in a Player Owned Town under any circumstances." I apologize for the inconvenience!

 

Believe you have to pay rent regardless of whether or not your property is on a PoT or not(if it's not a pledge lot), so why not pay a reasonable fee to the PoT owner if they're letting you stay in their PoT?

 

I voted "Yes, but only for in-game gold", but my vote needs some further explanation.

If I owned a non rent-free lot deed (i.e. one I bought from the add-on store or acquired in-game), I wouldn't want to play additional rent to a POT owner to place my deed in the POT.

If I did not own any lot deed and only wanted a place to store my loot, I would be very happy to rent a room from a POT owner or any home owner whatsoever for the privilege of having a room or a chest at my disposal to store things in.

 

No, I would not pay rent for land in a Player Owned Town under any circumstances.

But i would pay voluntary in-game gold to the town treasury if the gold is used for town events.
I wouldnt pay if the gold goes to the owner of the PoT.

 

Since most towns won't charge rent from their citizens (like mine) then the question is rather what each town can offer, instead of what it costs.

In some cases for some players they can only get an offer for what they want from POTs that has costs associated with them.

So a generic response to a question whether you are prepared to pay something is missing the crucial; for what?

For instance, Blackstone Bluff will be truly unique with its custom built scene. Lots of players will see that offer and say that they want to pay real cash for that.

Others really like the gritty feel of Rats' Nest because of its PvP theme and its row lots only premise, and say they want to pay a monthly in game gold rent for that.

Or the grand organizations of PaxLair, BEAR, Phoenix Republic, BMC, and such will also offer something on top due to their activity, which will be really attractive to some players.

Others will want a casual, fun and friendly place with less rules and no fees and consider a place like Lux Sanctuary.

Then you have a large demographic that will never want to place their property in any POT regardless of what they offer.

So you might want to add some granularity to that poll for it to be able to show you what you seek.

 

I'm really enjoying what everyone has to say about this so far! Part of the reason why I didn't make more options for the poll was to see if there was ever any circumstance people would fall under the categories listed. The discussion is for people to discuss the granulation of their vote and others' ideas.

Thank you for chiming in!

 

I'm in a situation where I was able to reserve a plot from my guild's metro with no rent of any kind. I will likely end up paying for that privilege (voluntarily) simply by donating in-game gold or resources or whatever to the guild to help support the members... so it will sort of be the same as paying rent. It's not required, but supporting my guild is just my playstyle.

However, the lot I have is only a row lot. Now, depending on the necessity for a village or larger lot for planting crops or placing beneficial items on my property, or even perhaps for having a place to store stuff in another region... I may consider renting a lot in a POT. I would only consider paying in game gold though and not real cash.

While I understand that POT owners laid out a substantial investment, they just have too much power over the lots and can simply take your money and evict you for any reason with no recourse. I'm not saying that all of them or even a big percentage of them will do this, but it only takes one scammer to get burned. The risk is too great to pay real cash for me.

You may counter and say that would ruin the reputation for that owner and put him out of business. But I've been around for a long time and have seen people strike after growing a good reputation for a final money grab.

Again, I'm not insinuating this will happen here. But my experience will keep me away from such a risk.

I'm perfectly willing to risk in game gold because virtual currency is not something that keeps food off my table.

Anyway, that's my view on the subject.

 

This is one of the topics I was hoping I could edge people into discussing. This is a real concern.

If I may, I'd like to pick on you since you brought it up. Please talk with us about this!

Objectively looking at all sides of the situation (there are more than two - developers, town owners, and all players have different stakes in this), how would you craft a system that gave players assurance that governors wouldn't take advantage of you?

I have a few ideas of my own:

• Make denizens of POTs able to vote monthly on the performance of the governor (with the qualification to vote being that a player has lived there for at least 168 hours, which is 7 days), with one vote per account (so those with multiple characters can't "scam" the system). All votes are equal - nothing based on the size of one's plot (to make it so that governors must listen to everyone versus their biggest donor). Denizens would vote on a single virtue that the governor exemplified the best/worst, and the governor would then gain/lose virtue points. The downside to this plan is that people who want to have a certain virtue status may not like being forced by their people to gain or lose virtue. The benefit of this (or something like this) is that it puts some tangible power in the hands of people living in a governor's land that is in line with the SotA story/RP.
• Create a developer approved constitution that governors can opt to follow. While breaking the rules set forth in the constitution would be allowed, the POT owners would incur significant penalties. The downside is that Portalarium would have to make game masters enforce the penalties, and for that the rules would have to be extremely cut and dry and Portalarium would have to make game mechanics that would keep track of the pertinent details (such as creating a full rental system - which will probably not come in any time soon).
• Create a game-based escrow system where players can pay rent, but the rent is not given to the POT owner until the time of the lease is up or the renter leaves on their own.

 

I like the idea of a Rent Deed. It is clean and simple.

You could buy them for in game gold or RL Cash in the Add-on Store. It would allow the player to "rent" a lot (and house) for 30 days. A town owner or steward could have to approve the rental (i.e. Like Resident Status) or it could be marked as open rental.

As the rental time limit approaches (5 days?) the renter can apply another deed. (gold or cash purchased) to add another 30 days to the term.

If the renter leaves or revokes, the deed is lost and the gold immediately given to the town owner.
If at any point the renter is evicted, the rental deed is returned to the renter at 100% value, so they could simply find another place to rent and lose nothing.
At the end of the agreed term, the town owner is credited the gold from the transaction.

 

the deed you buy from the store is a "rent deed" you already will pay a healthy tax to the game if you place it.

 

This is about Renting property lot and house a town owner already owns, not Other player's Owning it, Correct?

So if I have a Row Lot in Bastion's Point and I want to rent it to another player who does not own a deed or house - how does that play out? I thought that is what we were taking about but I could be mistaken. I don't see how the in-game tax applies to the lots in the add-on store.

 

It is! @Ravicus Domdred was talking about the in-game mechanic that acts like a gold sink. This thread is about POT owners who want to charge for homesteading in their territory.

 

I understand that. thats why I posted what I posted. There are tax free deeds (in game mechanic) and taxable deeds (in game mechanic) I do not want any other taxation in the game other than what port has suggested. If the town owners want to tax above that then they should have to do it manually. I do not want my contributions going to an in game gold collection system for slum lords.

 

Also, WAY back when the Q1 schedule was drafted, there was this:

RELEASE 16, March 26, 2015

• Housing: Permissions for property will greatly expand to better support groups sharing of property, including tools to rent rooms and set “per area/room” permissions.

So I believe they have a plan and design for rental, but I think it just kept getting pushed off into the distance. It is still there somewhere and I bet they have some player protection built into that plan.

 

So you are saying you are in favor of me charging a player 5,000 gold to rent a house from me for a month and then then next day I evict them because I feel like it and they just lose the gold with no protection? Because there is no manual way to get their money back from me. I mean with a Owners Deed I can evict someone and they get all their stuff back including the deeds so what is lost is time and effort, but when we are talking about renting property I think we need some sort of checks and balances performed by the game. Again, this is not about PoT Owners Taxing a fee on top of a players OWNED deed, this is about a player having nothing and RENTING a space.

Actually come to think of it, it's really not a function of the TOWN, its a function of the PROPERTY OWNER because this system really can be applied to any lot, in a PoT or Story Town. It's a much bigger animal and you need to account for items on the property owned by a player and having that player removed from the lot properties. As I mentioned above, renting rooms or renting property is more then just faith in a Town Owner.

 

I am not sure what you read but I did not say anything like that. I am not in favor of anyone charging anything above and beyond what the game taxes.

 

Again, perhaps it is me who is confused then. I thought the OP was about Renting Existing Property, not Taxing or Surcharging. There is no current in-game system to handle Renting.

If it's about renting a Lot Marker to someone who owns a lot deed, then yeah that is basically taxing and I was confused.

 

@Aartemis and @Ravicus Domdred : I'm talking about everything you're both saying!

To break things down more simply to reconcile your points/confusion:

1. Land is a scarce resource.
2. Governors own land.
3. People want land.
4. If a governor wants to charge money for the use of their land, whether you provide your own plot deed or not, would you pay in-game gold, real money, either, or neither (as in you would not pay)?

 

I would not live in a POT if they paid me once I place a land deed, only I should have the right to move it or lose it if I fail to pay the game's gold sink..
A lot Deed is bought from Portalarium either by in game gold or real money, so It comes under Portalarium TOS not any POT owner's petty rule's, to evict or ban me from any part of the game.

You should have had the option to vote: Never to live in a POT.

 

I didn't understand this. >.>

I didn't want to do that at first, but I think it might be a good idea to do so now.