Loot, where is it?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Katu, Aug 19, 2020.

  1. Katu

    Katu Avatar

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    Loot, as we all know, is missing.
    I have 5 friends testing this game. Few subscribed, one bought EP2 access for bards, so they are something that we are looking for. New players that are willing to pay a little, here and there. These are kind of players, that are really, really trying to like the game. Grinding is not a problem, fps is not a problem, amount of players is not a problem. They are 60-95adv level, bards, tamers, archers, swordsmans.

    Now, the biggest issue, seems to be the lack of feeling for progress. They can go to higher tier zones ( to fight same mobs, with higher stats ), but the loot is exactly the same as from the first zombies. They can gather, on their own, about 2-3k gold in hour and then you have scrolls, regs, arrows that need money. No new gear from mobs ( makes sense ). No money and not enought money worth gear to sell.

    They should now be looking for gear upgrade, but it's impossible. How can they ever buy even a set that costs 100k with weapons, when they get 0-1k after running expenses per hour? If they get the 100k gear, how long it takes to get back the costs?

    Please note, they do not wanna have handouts. They are not accepting my money either.

    I, as a 110 advlvl fire/life mage, can maybe generate 15k hour. It might be better to just mine silver, than try to fight mobs and hope for some super rare artifact. With 250M xp, I can finally do something that gets me money. My gear is worth over 1M. I never loot that amount. Ever.

    Why there has been no changes for the loot, after sucking so hard for all these years? Why not implement a system, that scales the loot, based on adventure level or something similar.

    Do not point me to a gold making guide or anything silly.

    We lose these players and I don't blame em. I keep on playing for now, like I did before. But there has got to be changes for loot. Its bad that there is nothing good to expect, after killing a dragon. Absolutely nothing.
    Blaming super high level players for it, is not a fix either.

    Loot sucks so much, that my computer is dust free, if I just keep playing SotA.
    Loot sucks so much, that I lose money on other games, everytime I kill something in SotA.
    Loot sucks so much, that we are losing players for it.

    (PS: good game, I like it still )
     
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  2. Last Trinsic Defender

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    Yes @Katu you are right. But I have to confess - nothing new.
    That's a problem for many years now, promised to be changed vor years and honestly I don't think will be changed in many years to come.
    That's a lack of concept.
     
  3. Katu

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    Yeah, I am not holding my breath here. It's just a shame. There is loot attenuation? already in game, so whats the fear? We just killed Aether scorpion and got absolutely nothing from it.
     
  4. GMDavros

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    Feel your pain Katu. There's no reward for your risk. Unless you have a thing for rusty cookware. Been promised over and over, but never really delivered on.

    Fenris
     
  5. Xee

    Xee Bug Hunter

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    I think the issue is that not many realize this is a player market system which gear is to be made by players so artifacts are the only alternative which is rare loot. Beyond that everything else is just materials to break down or to sell as trash. Money is easy to make if you have a vendor and are in a good spot or you have to advertise your wares. As to cost on gear there are plenty of options you need to shop around. Some people sell top gear for a lot , well others sell almost the same for a fraction. the downside unless you know where to shop you could be stuck paying high prices. I do think that there needs to be an expand on the loot system, perhaps like artifacts dropping stat based gear that could be upgraded by crafters as a trade off. or perhaps create a whole expanded system where more artifacts drop but can be taken apart to build better player made this way adventures who have no money and want loot rewards still get something of value that still also has value to crafters to take apart in hopes to get a stat or effect based material through salvage.

    If you dont have a vendor you will have to use trade channel to make your money. What you may think that the loot you are getting is junk there is really a lot of value. Essense's from mobs for dungeons net 200gold plus per essence. Scrap in bulk from breaking down weapons as well. materials for higher end potions now have a lot more value. Ores, woods etc are all worth 150gold + So all of that adds up to $$$$ in the end which if you have an outlet to trade off / sell can net you thousands of gold a week which than the gear you buy does not seem as pricey.

    If you want cheaper gear I recommend checking out Silverdale Market. 130+ MW / Enchanters with average gear cost between 30-80k per slot which is cheap. I do recommend that you find yourself a crafter friend and make deals with them trade for your gear to further cut costs down. some crafters like myself are more than willing to make people gear in exchange for materials.

    guess we will see how things go in the future for gear and hope that it looks better for you.
     
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  6. Sulaene Moon

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    I don't have a vendor and I've tried that on the vendor channel, but people yelled at me for spamming. Most times I am on there are usually very limited people playing at the same time. I hope they increase the gold drop and increase the amount npcs will pay for items. If not it will take me so much time to collect or make enough to buy better gear.
     
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  7. Xee

    Xee Bug Hunter

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    Id recommend not just the trade channel in game , discord Shroud of the Avatar trade channel is great, as well the forums in the player market section. Another option is to look at what you have to sell to crafters and find a vendor selling items made from that then mail in game that crafter to see if they are interested in buying your wears. there are also vendors that setup buy orders for specific materials. downside there is no general way to find these vendors which can be tedious looking for one.
     
  8. Gorthyn

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    All of which is fine in theory but as crafting seems to permanently an issue in itself then you have a double edged sword of a problem. I think what is frustrating for folk is that none of this fundamental stuff ever gets fixed year after year.
     
  9. Katu

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    First, to start selling something on vendors to make this "easy money". You have to do a lot before that. Either you place down your big payments or it simply is not going to happen. Lets not even start with getting the required skills to get something decent to sell. There is no loot.
    30-80k per slot is not cheap, if you can make maximum of 20k, including quest money a week.
    No, no they are not. Copper and iron are waste of space. 25gold each.
    Silver is 100 at tops.
    They don't add up, because there is nothing to add up.
    I already suggested my friends to either Elysium mining or running around for beetles. That is not a fix. It's playing around a huge issue, to even survive.
    But that time is all away from actually adventuring in the game. It's not a solution, it's a duct tape fix.

    --- not directed to Xee ->
    How can we run this player run economy, if new players and old, can't get money? It's all an illusion. There is no economy. There is VERY high level trading going on, but nothing else.
    There is no way for a new player, that did not buy gold or get it from someone, to buy decent gear from anywhere. My friends here, they are the top dogs. They have played their all lives, very competitive and very able players. Not your average, 50-60y player, who strugles with WASD controls. It Cannot be this hard.

    Again, I am fine. I barely make what I spend. Thats ok. But I'm not a new player. 1k hours atleast, been here since the early times. But my friends, whom I know from real life, will not stay here for a long. Loot is bad, thats what I hear all the time we play. Its a joke really. We have killed dragons and siege bosses. Got nothing. Few gems, shared by 5 man party.

    We have crafter friends, but that does not help the thing. Getting resources needed for decent gear, even low decent, takes for ever. Then what? Is the 100k, 200k,300k enought to make difference on the character? Can it now progress further? To better loot? No. Loot sucks at all levels unless you are super high or get lucky.

    Crafting is expensive, thus prices are expensive. Loot is bad, thus prices should be lower. New players have no buying power. Prices are NOT made by demand. There cannot be demand. Either you have gear or you dont' Its not like you shop new set every week. It's not player run economy. It's not economy.

    If loot is bad because they want players to buy cotos, to turn em to igg, thats not working. Only few percent of players play with that mentality. Subscribing and buying EP2 access should be enought to get in to game. Game should first demand full attention from player before starting to drain money from them, not the other way around.

    Even money is not the solution here. If I now buy 100$ cotos pack, sell for igg and buy gear. I very efficiently locked myself out of ingame progression for ever. Now I need to open wallet everytime I want progression. Thats bad..
     
  10. Superbitsandbob

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    I wouldn't get your hopes up sadly. New scenes like Spindelskog was a great opportunity to put in a boss or some mini bosses with some new loot drops but it was more crafting loot drops again.

    The player economy is broken and was always going to be eventually as there seems to be a minority of players who are able to treat SOTA almost like a fulltime job. The prices being charged for equipment as you level becomes daft as there are only a few crafters making it. A player run economy would work with a healthy population and healthy competition but at this point it is a monopoly, especially at the high end gear range. Hundreds of thousands to a million + for high end gear. Eventually most players will hit a wall character progression wise unless they invested heavily in crafting and went through that grind and everything else that goes with it. It's really hard as the loot drops you get don't keep up with the prices of player made gear.

    SOTA is just not the game if you are looking for tangible PvE rewards to upgrade your character.
     
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  11. CICI

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    The player economy is Fine =D Just need to know what your doing! Most PVE players can make 1 million gold a week and that's not playing all day long...can also use that gold to trade items to make more gold =D
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2020
  12. Xee

    Xee Bug Hunter

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    I think the issue is that people are use to other mmo's where every turn or quest some gear drops which could be better than what you had. This is a whole different style where you save up for the next replacement gear which could take a month depending on what you set your sites on. 30-80k for a new player is indeed too much. 30-80k gear I sell is up with the higher level crafters and is not meant for new players. The problem is that new players can wear top end gear as there is no gear level cap so in turn a player who sees top end gear wants top end gear because they can wear. new players should be buying gear crafted by people their level which is why the economy does not work well. A new player must decide do a I save up for the top gear or do I buy something that looks sub par in comparison for say 3k vs the 30k. This also creates as you mentioned a false market where only the top crafters pretty much run everything because what is the point of buying a 3k gear if you know you can get better? I agree with you 100% on the issue at hand. this also makes people not want to invest in crafting because they have a hard time selling when there is better that anyone can wear.

    My point on selling ore etc is that either way if you farm it you can sell it and make money. I think based on what you say I am over paying lol. I usually dont buy ore but the ingots at 100 for 25k and generally spend 200k-500k a week on materials I get from other vendors. This is where locations is key. For example silverdale vendors big and small all benefit as I tend to buy local in my market before I look else where in order to help keep my market healthy. So small guys can make profit however its all commodities.... gear that some try to sell becomes an issue because of the above....

    I have always stated that gear drops for adventure needs to be there. and that perhaps making named bosses that guarantee a drop as a rare mob spawn maybe as @Superbitsandbob mentioned as away to improve things. that way if you are just killing dragons well there is a chance of loot if the named one spawns you know there is loot. having named mobs random spawn in random scenes would make it become a hunt and people would get excited when they see a boss that has loot. even making them abit harder would be fine. Another would be to have specific loot of different tiers drop. putting a randomizer on the stats for one making it so there is ok to epic type that could drop which also makes the loot have more value if its a rare top stat item. many games use this method because its tired and true and gives players always a chance to get something epic. the loot bags well nice for random is not enough drive imo for warrant farming them for a chance of loot.

    My only though is we still need to keep it so crafters can make the best but add more options for better loot results. Now if there was a better way for crafters to dump better gear into the loot tables for drops which would reward them for the time and mats than players could technically fill that gap a little. but sadly why would any crafter dump top gear to vendors for 150g when the costs are 20k to make based on player economy?
     
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  13. Superbitsandbob

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    Oh come on. I've been playing every day for about 5 days now straight, not all day, doing circuits of Torc's, various dragons (even aether dragons), tamer arti mobs, Rise, Ruined etc etc and the loot has not approached anywhere near a million. Your comments feel a bit head in the sand my crafting empire is fine please move along. I was watching Fzol and also another playing doing constant loot mob loops to get some idea of where to go. They were much quicker and better than me at it and their loot was also not how you are trying to paint it. The average player, which would be "most" players I guess, have no chance. Maybe if you are super super duper lucky. You've then of course got to sell these things into a market that is flooded with worthless artifacts.
     
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  14. CICI

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    Low end artifacts sell quick for 4k-5k ea =D an when you find a good spot that drops the loot for that given day/week you just farm that spot =D lol

    and troll essence sells for 800 Gold per =D
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2020
  15. oplek

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    I agree. No one should have to leave the game to figure something out.

    Been playing Satisfactory lately. It's a quite complex game... not as complex as Factorio, but still quite. Number of times I had to go google or research something out of game: zero.
     
  16. Superbitsandbob

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    So your advice to most players is to spend all week farming dozens of low end artifacts and then hope to sell them all in a massively saturated market in the hopes of getting enough gold to spend on equipment. Which is probably inflated in price anyway because of the small population and no competition. And then they have to spend their time running around PoT's when they would probably much rather be out adventuring to find it. I mean, I'll run it by them. I assumed though that they just wanted tangible rewards for their PvE adventures.
     
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  17. Scanphor

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    I think part of the loot problem is in how their system 'balances' it by equating a 0.1% chance of getting something worth 100k gold to getting 100 gold every time. I would argue that this is a false equivalency in 'feelgood factor' and the 100g every time feels much better, however much it might look the same on an excel sheet....

    There are very small chances of getting very valuable things in loot/loot bags that mean the system thinks loot rewards are 'good' from a specific mob that ultimately equate to hours and hours of grinding for no perceptible reward.
     
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  18. Scanphor

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    Let's do the math on troll essences - 800 gold per means 1,250 of those to get to 1m. Lets say you kill a troll as an 'average' non-uber high end player and get a drop every 2 mins (I suspect with the odd break / respawns its a fair bit longer than that). That equates to just under 42 hours of grinding trolls to get your 'typical' 1m per week - which is pretty much a full time job. I've already got one of those thanks. ;)
     
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  19. CICI

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    Also the other loot =D Supply Bundles/Obsidian Chips /Gems Etc.
     
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  20. Charon

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    Fixed.