Macroing

Thanks for the tips some of those are gems @Roper Docholiday

 

Would it help to require a percentage of skills on your skill bar or your basic attack to be on (leveling) at all times? That way you wouldn't be able to build a huge xp pool to macro. It might make the macro advantage de minimis.

 

Perhaps the main issue is not just macroing, but cheating. We need a strong anti-cheat design to avoid that, say, 50% of the players became cheaters (no one can ban half of their player base, right?) and, once just 1% or 2% of the players became cheaters (because it is hard to do)... then ban them! An aggressive policy might me needed from the start of the game (August) to prevent the cheater community to grown and develop.

 

Is macroing cheating? Considering that Portalarium partnered to sell a keyboard that included macro functions, I think I have a minor issue with the assertion that macroing is cheating.

I mean, i don't do it myself, but I think that argument may create some conflicts of interest.

 

Macroing as stated in the OP, is not really cheating. All other forms of macroing, are what should be thought of as wrong only, which this thread is not truly about. This thread is about BDF and a few others believing that I should not be able to use up my XP pool (however I wish) that I've earned already.

 

And good point, since Port has supported Razer, then macroing is totally on the table lol! FOREVER

 

Sure that macros can be used without cheating, but people that are against macroing are really against macros used as a way to cheat. "Ca va de soi", e.g. it´s assumed without further explanation.

 

We have two systems:
1) A level gain and exp gain system.
2) A skill use gain system layered on top.

We have two types of play from it:
1) Gaining exp, levels and skills while hunting.
2) Gaining exp and levels while hunting and then micro managing skill gains with macros after.

I actually put in more time in the game because I do option 2).

I sorta enjoy hunting and leveling. As in, I've done the grind too many times and I've dulled the fun out of the game from too much playtesting. That and the mobs are not smart or dynamic*

I love micro managing my character. I don't afk macro as you can overshoot your target and waste exp. I hate wasted exp! I will put a 9v battery on a key while I'm reading the forums.

Combat skills IRL require drills and training. Gust balls are fine. Make them stop at level 80 or something up there so eventually people need to leave the basement to use the skills in a live environment.

Would you take shooting ranges away from cops because they are not real training on live humans? This talk of getting rid of gust balls is meh.

I believe people are more annoyed that some have figured out how to get good amounts of exp fairly quick (in this accelerated testing environments) over the use of the gust ball itself.

*Im looking at you Ghost Corpion you 98,000 exp piñata. Why can I get you in discharge range but you can't hit me with that 12' tail? Please please please kill me next time I get close to you.

 

I'm positive the dev's will give us a training dummy soon for such matters can't wait!

 

Actually he said that people that are macro'ing are gaming the system and not playing the game. That is a polite way for saying cheating. I do agree with your statement above that the game should be fixed and that is what Chris said as well. I am not entirely sure what the argument is at this point. Chris said he is going to fix it. That is all I need to hear. Users that are macro'ing now should use SPO mode as a curtsy to everyone else online.

 

By the way here are the relevant parts of the EULA:

Spoiler: Excerpts from the Portalarium End User License Agreement 1.4 released February 12, 2015

(taken from here), a "...." means some text has been snipped)

I. Limited Use License
.....
You agree that you will not, under any circumstances
....

• Use cheats, automation software (bots), hacks, mods or any other unauthorized third-party software designed to modify the Game experience;

....

• Use any unauthorized third-party software that intercepts, “mines”, or otherwise collects information from or through the Game or the Website, including without limitation any software that reads areas of RAM used by the Game to store information about a character or the game environment; provided, however, that PORTALARIUM may, at its sole and absolute discretion, allow the use of certain third party user interfaces;
• Modify or cause to be modified any files that are a part of the Game Client in any way not expressly authorized by PORTALARIUM;

....

V. Consent to Monitor

....
..... . In the event that the Game detects an unauthorized third party program, (a) the Game may communicate information back to us, including without limitation your Account username, details about the unauthorized third party program detected and the activities or functions performed thereby, and/or (b) we may exercise any or all of its rights and remedies under the PORTALARIUM Terms without prior notice to the user(s) linked to such unauthorized third party program.
....

So, for the most part it's just about bots and hacking. Though it does contain some vague phrasings that call for clarification. Like, what exactly is a "cheat"? Or, what does "modify the Game experience" mean exactly? I'd guess these will be clarified sooner or later.

(and as an aside, certain relevant parts in section V does also contain some rather interestingly vague phrasings, things that make me wonder if I should chroot my game client (or put it inside a VM) just for security reasons, but I digress, considering the topic of this thread)

 

Well, we all have a right to our own interpretations don't we

 

Then it sounds like we need to establish what use of macros is okay, and what isn't.

Gaming the system is part of games. Being a munchkin is not cheating, but it's completely about gaming the system. RPers may hate munchkins, because they end up with ridiculous results that are out-of-role, but they ARE using the system, as implemented, even if their usage is not in the spirit of it.

 

Oninoshiko,

Everyone is entitled to an opinion. I think is it twisted thinking to try to justify it. Here are the facts from Chris' post.
1. Macroing is not playing the game.
2. It needs to be fixed.

Let me add this...
1. Games are played by humans not computers.

It is cheating in my book and I will never see it differently. If someone else wants to call it something else to justify their actions, that is fine with me. Just do it somewhere the players that are not cheating can't see it please.

 

You can think it's cheating all you want, but Chris did not say it's cheating, he said it's "gaming the system." Min-maxing also gaming the system, but is also is not cheating. What Chris said needed fixed was xp/skill-conversion balance and high-use/low-use skill balance. He implied macroing was a symptom rather then a real problem.

If you don't want to see people playing in a way you don't like, YOU should go where you can't see them.

 

I'd love for him to come out and say that so I'd know if I'm doing something wrong. As a community leader that would be pretty helpful. @Chris

The Razer product I own has an option to "play key repeatedly while pressed". Hence the 9v battery is just the right weight. Am I cheating when I have no programming skills at all and I'm just using a product they fully endorse and advertise i.e branding the Shuttered Eye? After I went out and gained the exp?

I'd call that spending the exp I earned within a system that encourages this practice by being the way it is.

Gaming the system is when a ton of us were loggining in and out to kill the ghost corpion 10 times+ an hour for a minimum of 1 million exp per hour. Thats gaming a system and behavior I won't do in a non-testing environment. Since then the corpion has been put on a timer as all bosses should be and not respawn when the master leaves the scene. Thats just good testing and I hope people keep finding these things now instead of 55 million dollar mistakes post final wipe.

I do agree that doing the same task over and over should be done in private... I hate seeing the gust balls in town but you can always just gust the ball out of range.

As someone who has 12.6 million in his pool right now from grinding till nausea, I agree with Chris that this problem seems greater then it is because we have such accelerated exp gains and people can gain wayyyyyyyy more then they can burn unless they are working skills post GM or innates.

 

Lol, I which you the best in that fantasy world. That is too funny.

 

I wish you the best in the one where everyone just does whatever you say just because you say it. If you think anyone is going to change what they are doing because it annoys you, wow... just wow.

 

Is training Gust on a Gustball considered wrong? ;p

 

One thing I still want to comment before calling it a day:

While I agree wholeheartedly with the basic sentiment (would prefer real training equipment to gust balls though), I think artificial skill level ceilings would be unnecessary, if the training gear had limited durability. Therefore using it would have certain cost. The exponential skill learning curve would take care of the rest. I think this would be better at least for roleplaying reasons -- there is really no limit in skill level where training gear stops being useful (at least not with IRL combat skills).