Magic & environmental factors

Discussion in 'Skills and Combat' started by redfish, Jun 21, 2015.

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  1. redfish

    redfish Avatar

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    So, this is based on a topic that came up some time ago in the Dev+ forums. I wanted to set up a thread here so people could add their own suggestions. We're going to have weather in the future, and the dev team has promised it would interact with magic, but there are a lot of non-weather environmental factors, too.

    For example,

    Bushes and brush : they should be set on fire by Fire Magic spells, meaning that someone stuck in the bushes when targeted by an AoE fire magic will continue to take extra DOT unless he gets out of the area. This could also cause normal fire spells to have a large AoE and chain to multiple targets.

    While screenshoting the Vengeance event I saw a lot of brush area that would have been fun to see go ablaze when people used fire magic spells. People would have to get out of the area or continue to get torched.

    [​IMG]

    Cobwebs : they would also similarly set on fire.

    Wooden bridges : the would also be able to be set on fire. Also in Vengeance, there's an old wooden bridge where I think it would be fun if it could be set on fire. That way, during a PvP fight, someone would have to decide whether to brave the fire, or find another way around -- presumably down through the dry river bed -- and their opponent can set the bridge on fire intentionally to slow them down.

    [​IMG]

    Sandy and gravelly environments : here it would make sense if Gust not only blew wind, but kicked up dust from the ground. I know, being in deserts, that whenever there's any commotion that disrupts the ground, dust comes up. That's is also what leads to sandstorms. The effect of sand on Gust would be to blind anyone affected by the spell, similar to the Blind spell in the Sun Magic school. The Gust visual effects would also appear sandier.

    [​IMG]

    Water : being in water should cause lightning spells to chain and hit anyone in the water. So if two people are near each other in the water, hitting one with lightning will chain to the second person. Its would also be harder to miss. Fire DOT should either not occur, or should extinguish quickly while someone is in water. Someone who has a fire debuff and jumps in the water should also have it extinguished. Ice damage should be extra-effective, as it would freeze the water around the player and on his body.

    Also, as suggested by Themo Lock, being in water could set an extended "Wet" debuff which would last for a period of time after the player exits the water. That way, someone who just existed a stream would have some of the same vulnerabilities as someone who is sitting in a stream. Certain types of magic that use heat would remove the "Wet" debuff.

    Shadows : Moon Magic really needs to be able to track whether a person is standing in a shadowed area or not. A lot of play-spaces like arenas are open areas where a Moon mage can't hide except for dark shadows -- where his magic should work.

    Heat from magma: ice spells and water should have a greatly reduced to zero buff time.
     
  2. TantX

    TantX Avatar

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    I'd like to see the environments strengthen or weaken certain spell disciplines, too. Maybe lower Focus cost for Water spells if you're on a water map or in an area of water (beaches and shores, lakes, swamps, etc.). Same for Fire, maybe strengthen it based on fires in the area. This would be a cool element because setting fire to fallen logs, brushes and even people would strengthen or make the Fire mage stronger, but only for a time, because eventually that fire dies and leaves nothing but char and ash. Then they can't get that buff further, meaning a Water mage could douse the flames and take away that damage building element.
     
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  3. Bowen Bloodgood

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    Problems with fire:

    No lasting environmental effect without a LOT of extra work.

    So let's say you set that bridge on fire.. as a static object it never actually takes damage and burns down. Not unless you build wooden bridges to burn down.. even then they still have to be there later. Same with bushes.. do they disappear and grow back? Or does the fire eventually burn out leaving the bushes unscathed? Then what about trees? Would you burn down a forest only for it to be standing healthy as can be once the fire is gone?

    What about a field of tall grass such as in Greymark.. where does the fire stop?
     
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  4. redfish

    redfish Avatar

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    Would shardfalls boost Chaos magic?

    I don't think they can make it fully realistic, but I think some limited, and there are some definite issues to be sorted out, but a temporary effect could work. After the fire wears out, if it does, you could even make everything look "charred" until the person leaves the scene. The devs were talking earlier about attacks on towns causing fires, and I assume there are some of the same issues there.

    Btw, trees are also an interesting idea to include, because there was a discussion about climbing trees and how, if players were allowed to do that, it would create a big opportunity for griefers. Some griefer could just climb a tree and spam players with attacks. But then what if you could burn him out of the tree?
     
  5. redfish

    redfish Avatar

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    Which also brings up an interesting question of whether smoke and ash will be in the game, and other noxious fumes like at volcanoes, and how it would effect players. Certainly, oxygen problems might come up in certain mining scenarios.
     
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  6. Bowen Bloodgood

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    If you're going that far.. metal armor could be a huge detriment to anyone facing a mage. As a conductor the wearer could potentially take more damage from fire, cold and electric attacks. unless they have some sort of effective insulation.
     
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  7. redfish

    redfish Avatar

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    Btw, below is where I got the idea for setting bushes and brushes on fire -- from the Grunvald Shardfall -- where there are places where you can actually completely hide yourself in bushes to remain undetected. I've left myself visible there, but there are places in between the bushes you can move where you're well hidden, and you can even go in the middle of a bush.

    [​IMG]

    Its a small, contained area, so theoretically, the whole area could be lit on fire without any complications about it spreading. Or, just a single bush.
     
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  8. Mastese

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    This actually makes sense, in a physical vs. metaphysical equalizing kind of way. To my heavy armor wearing, bludgeon wielding, strength based melee build....mages are simply an annoyance that wither under the weight of my blows once they're in arms reach. Something like this would heighten the priority to close distance fast.
     
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  9. Katrina Bekers

    Katrina Bekers Localization Team

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    Yeah, sure, buff fire even more.

    If all fire spells will ever do 1 damage at most, then feel free to set on fire the world. Not a second before.
     
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  10. redfish

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    Just don't stand around in areas that are burning :) I also did include some ways to get rid of fire DOTs, like jumping into the water. Also, we have a Douse spell. Obviously also fire should be less powerful when its raining, and air/lightning magic should be more powerful; I just didn't want to get into weather in this thread.
     
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  11. redfish

    redfish Avatar

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    Another thing I think should be added to this list is swamp gas, as seen in Witcher 3. It would burst into flames when ignited.
     
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  12. monkeysmack

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    You could just take node behavior and extend it to other objects. A burned bush would stay burned in that instance for a certain time. But, adding object behavior more generally to the gaming engine would be a huge development task.
     
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  13. redfish

    redfish Avatar

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    I thought of something else.

    In environments with snowy slopes, an avalanche should result if the slope is within the radius of an Earthquake spell.

    [​IMG]
     
  14. mikeaw1101

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    All awesome ideas, but I'll bet they have the dev's cringing...
     
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  15. Miracle Dragon

    Miracle Dragon Legend of the Hearth

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    Yes to this thread.
     
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  16. redfish

    redfish Avatar

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    I bet the devs would be excited if they could make it happen, even if they'd cringe at the difficulties involved ... I've enjoyed seeing the game grow over the last several releases, and more and more it feels like a living world... you can wander around and catch horses running across the road during a storm, under a starscape that changes with the seasons. Eventually we'll be able to ride those horses. The water at the shore now grows stormier with the weather, and reflects the landscape, and soon jumping in will make splashes. Storms, I'm assuming, will also affect sea travel when boats come in later.

    Making all these environmental factors affect magic and combat, too, would be all the more exciting.
     
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  17. smack

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    Sounds a bit like the system used in Divinity: Original Sin. It would be great to see a similar system, like the one you described, in SotA too.
     
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  18. redfish

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    Oh, yes, and there are ice lakes in the game. Players should be at risk of slipping while they walk on these, and Gust or any other knockdowns on ice should push the player further away than normal. In the game, btw, I knocked down a mob down a set of stairs using Gust; I would think that would do damage.

    Its also hard to see how Root would work on an ice lake, since there's only water beneath, and no place for the root to come from, unless its a very long root.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2015
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  19. Curt

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    In D&D the spells heat/chill metal clearly shows the drawback with metal armour in hot/cold places
     
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  20. Curt

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    I would be very careful with using fire if i was standing on a ice lake.
     
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