NO MORE INT, STR, DEX INNATES!

well if you want to narrow my statement yes. But overall, all I am saying is things have changed from the original plan. So things can still change.

 

It's not contrary to the games vision, since the classless system DOES restrict you to certain things already, it just clusters synergistic powers by theme rather than by role, and compromises itself to allow hybridization in ways that it wouldn't have to if you could create characters that have more thematic freedom but were less able to cover all roles within their theme.

 

This is true.. but the comparison you made was something that was entirely new but didn't change much (if anything) that was already in place. vs the topic of changing how the skill system works to support a more class/archtype system when it's always been classless.

 

whatever, you can have the last word.

 

You're using a lot of vague terminology. Examples? Specific ones..

 

Maybe this is a side-track to the original discussion, but I disagree that the longevity in an MMO is just in the multiplayer content.

I would guess that a huge bulk of players of any MMO are playing the game solo and aren't interested in the social elements of the game. These solo players then leave the game not long after they finish the story elements, since your typical MMO is grindy and doesn't have any re-playability. More content -- in terms of more story elements, more scenes, etc -- is one thing -- that may bring back solo players for a while. But the key to keeping solo gamers around even in the gaps between content delivery would be to make the core elements of gameplay less tedious and less of a grind. You want them doing the combat because the combat is fun, and not because they have to do the combat to get the next stage of the story. You want them doing resource gathering because the resource gathering is fun, and not because they have to do gathering to fulfill fetch quests or earn gold. The point would be to make the game endlessly re-playable.

Now, the social elements are also important for people who are interested in the multiplayer elements, and allowing players to create their own content, quests, etc. helps bring together both worlds. But the solo side of MMOs I think is something overly neglected -- and I hope the Portalarium devs don't allow themselves to neglect it.

 

Well, specific are up to the devs, but as an example: Currently intelligence boosts all magic, but magic does pretty much everything, from damage to healing to summoning to durability buffs. It's all thematically linked, but it's not linked to a specific role. That means you don't get such a thing as a specialized supporter or a specialized tank or a specialized damage dealer so much as simply a specialized magician who can pick the best powers for all types of situations - which is completely reasonable to round out a build in a game that allows it. Likewise if you want to expand your character into the martial realm any step you take toward being better at that makes you better at all aspects of it. You can't really build a character that specializes in a role to that extent where your progress in that direction makes you powerful in all aspects of that role across themes.

Even having a system where stat progression was two dimensional, with one dimension being the thematic one of might, finesse or magic, while the other was the role dimension of attack, defense or support would IMO make for a better system. I always look at the role dimension as being more important though for a deep multiplayer experience though.

 

hmmm getting the feeling I'm not quite on the same page with you but we'll leave it at that.

 

Wouldn't be a point to having a discussion forum if nobody ever disagreed on it.

 

Gabe Newell, founder of Valve (and therefore Steam) is a hobbyist blacksmith. He is far from stupid.