Sadistic game?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Witcheypoo, Sep 14, 2018.

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  1. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    When it comes to discussions regarding the death decay penalty, there's always the 10% or less posters who have no problem with it - and that invariably causes me to wonder how/why they can see no issue with it.

    Today is no different.

    For instance, when I saw this post from today:
    it made me wonder just how much time this particular poster has actually spent adventuring - in order to have this opinion.

    And then, unsurprisingly actually, I found the answer in another post from the same poster today:
    Go figure..... :confused:

    I am consistently amazed at how a few people can actually defend what @Budner so aptly described as a "misguided succubus" - and I realized - it doesn't affect them because they don't much expose themselves to it.
     
  2. Arradin

    Arradin Avatar

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    Nice try, but let make a couple of things clear:

    Just because one doesnt activly engage in a sertain topic, doesnt mean that that person is less knowlageable, and it absolutely do not mean they are wrong.

    As i described in the topics you quoted, i have played Ultima Online for almost 20 years. I have done everything from Crafting, to adventuring to PvPing all in loops over different times. I have been end game level raiding in games like wow over the years etc etc etc.

    Just because i have zero interrest for PvP here, and just because i dont currently do adventuring ( which im sure i will do again, when crafting gets too boring ) , doesnt mean that i have as much or more to say about the subject as you do, and i have the experience to back up my suggestions or ideas, because they are more than opinions

    Because you want everything for everyone, you want no penalty for dying whatsoever, you dont feel there should be any risk in the game at all, and the the fact that you just try to misscredit people who dont agree with you or prove you wrong, just mean how little of an "entire picture" overview you have of the game, and how little you care about the overall health of the game. It's all about you, its all about your opinion and its all about suiting your own gamestyle.

    If you want me to start quoting you all the posts in all the threads over the last 2 months alone where people are quitting over Portalarium making the game "too easy", i would , except you are not worth the time since you dont listen to anyone else but yourself. There are words to describe such people.

    Hi, My name is Arradin, i have now over 3000hours in this game where i have done everything a couple of times over, and if you dare to set your personal feelings aside and look at some facts, you can reach me on Discord.

    Much love
     
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  3. xadoor

    xadoor Avatar

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    Now I"m kinda curious @Arradin. Were you pro or con changing the failed enchants/masterworks blowing things up? Cause now I realize I'm a bit two faced. I would rather see the gear explode when you fail which is really harsh but there is a clear risk/reward cycle. But I'm leaning towards not wanting any death penalty ...perhaps cause very few rewards cycles are worth risking a death penalty. I die 50% of the runs when we farm blue Dragons and they almost never drop anything worth getting killed over. I think the risk in farming that dragon is the time lost that I could be crafting/grinding exp or mining.

    And yes, we are going in circles and I wont post about death penalty anymore unless people say stuff like "No argument" which implies we all agreed(and we haven't).
     
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  4. Arradin

    Arradin Avatar

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    I have stated several times that i am all for CHANGING Death XP penatly, but i am againt REMOVING it, because the game need Risk vs Reward.

    So i am not defending Death XP Loss, i am defending the risk involved with living dangerous.

    ( This is completely off topic, and i wont say anything more here, but the difference between the crafting and XP as you are saying is that with your argument, ALL kind of negative effect of failing a craft should be removed if death XP loss is to be removed completely. A failed craft result in Fuels lost and lower durability on the item, which more often than not cut the value in half in one fail. With all the logic in this thread transformed into crafting, there should be NO negative effects to a failed craft. Everyone would agree that that would be completely stupid, but yet for some people it make sense when arguing Adventure deaths. )
     
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  5. Brewton

    Brewton Avatar

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    @Arradin @FrostII You two are examples of the reason why Chris keeps telling why we can't have nice things.
    Now shake hands and make up. You both are on Super Triple Double Not-So-Secret Forum Probation!!
     
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  6. xadoor

    xadoor Avatar

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    I don't think its off topic. The topic is
    Sadistic game?
    That's pretty open ended. I wasn't trying use crafting to change your mind about death penalty(i'm done with that). I just saw above that you are a heavy crafter and was curious where you stood on that as I found it to be a bad change.

    BTW its not the same. The reward for NOT failing enchant/masterworks is a zillion times bigger than any reward to be had out adventuring to this point.

    I think Port actually discussed possibly letting you pay for a failed masterwork/enchant with a hit to the experience pool.
     
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  7. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    Thanks @Brewton, for your helpful comments and insights.
    My personal favorite of yours - so far - was:
    Nice........
     
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  8. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    You are correct, @Arradin
    I was merely pointing out a bit of a discrepancy in two of your posts today, referring of course to:
    followed by:
    That just had me scratching my head a bit is all.
    I'm sure you can clear it up.... right ?
     
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  9. Arradin

    Arradin Avatar

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    Sure can, its most likely the language barrier, but adventuring and exploring are two different things, and i used the two different in two seperate topics.

    Exploring= visiting new places,exploring new areas for the purpose of scenery not fighting.

    Adventuring= visiting areas for the purpose of fighting and gaining XP/items.

    So. I like exploring but dont like adventuring. I have visited most corners of the land where the risk is half the fun of exploring. So i dont want risk removed.

    Hope this clear up any confusion
     
  10. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    Thank you, @Arradin it does....

    You don't like "adventuring" IE "visiting areas for the purpose of fighting and gaining XP/items.".
    So, you don't "adventure" much to gain xp's.....

    I get it.

    And, since you don't do much fighting to gain xp's - then a death (accompanied by it's xp loss) is something that you don't find as a "negative".

    You "adventure" very rarely, but you do like the thrill of "exploring", since an occasional death or near death might await you - but it's no biggie if you do die, since you don't "adventure" much for xp's anyway.

    I get where you're coming from.

    You do understand, tho, that the majority of people attracted to SotA typically do "adventure" for xp's/items - and don't feel particularly happy when their time is stolen away.... don't you ?

    It just makes me sad that some people who don't adventure much, will argue in favor of a death penalty for those that do.

    That, is where I am coming from.
    Hope this clears up any confusion.

    Oh, and btw, since you're "99.9 % crafting" - you do realize that all those sales to people who purchase/use your crafts in their adventuring - will have no need for your crafts if they leave the game.... right ?

    We are connected.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2018
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  11. hackerssuck

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    The death penalty will typically punish casual players more than hardcore. Obviously, there are exceptions. I'm really disappointed in how they handle death penalty in this game. I sunk a good bit of coin into it, and now I feel like I won't play much because I don't like being punished for learning new stuff. I don't want to walk around overly cautious never wanting to try anything risky. That's boring as heck. I died once so far since I started after I got my collector's edition. I was in an "instance".. i.e. a cave where I zoned in to kill a corrupt druid. Got owned. Respawned outside with a debuff, but was not a ghost. Maybe I was too low level to actually have to find an ankh. That reminds me. This game is confusing.
     
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  12. SteelCore

    SteelCore Avatar

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    And the inbetween people like me. I am a lot online, almost finished "creating" my avatar in the way i want to have, but i am not such a XP grinder. Losing 500k+ XP on death needs a few days of my normal gaming to recover.
    So i always try to minimize the chances to die. I dont group up anymore to kill dragons, i never seen unicorns or tried that aether creatures… i avoid some new scenes and so on.
    And you know what ? It simply kills the fun playing this game because its not worth to die for the expected loot or experience in gameplay i would get if i would try.
    And even if the loot would be improved what could it be that is worth days of my playing time ?

    I am just speaking for myself.
     
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  13. Arradin

    Arradin Avatar

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    Correct, which is why Death penalty is being changed...... Or did you forget that already?

    Removing risk completely, however, would make crafting impossible because it would kill the game instantly, so i prefer to be patient and wait for a good substitute to XP Loss on death ;)
     
  14. Mykll

    Mykll Avatar

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    These forums are sadistic.

    There is already a hit when you die. Gear takes a hit and you spend a little time finding an ankh and going back to where you were. So people should say that it is not enough of a hit when you die and need something else added to it, be it current penalty, lessened penalty, or something completely different.
     
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  15. FrostII

    FrostII Bug Hunter

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    Death has some serious consequences in rl, why on earth do we need to follow that lead into a game ?
    Be careful with your answers, I'm baiting you.
    Be forewarned ..... ;)
     
  16. LiquidBlaze

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  17. Arkah EMPstrike

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    Because Some people enjoy the adrenaline risks give. Its not uncommon at all.

    And risk is not an absolute risk all or no risk. Theres different levels people enjoy
     
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  18. Mingo Ebonmark

    Mingo Ebonmark Avatar

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    The late Steve Jobs once said: 'Death is very likely the single best invention of life'.
     
  19. Tsumo2

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    "Resurrection Loss" would be more accurate than "Death Penalty" .
     
  20. Gamician

    Gamician Bug Hunter

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    How about if the penalty for Crafting or Gathering Failures was a loss of Producer XP? How about if that loss increased based on how high you were in the crafting skills? How about if you failed you lost the resources you were gathering and lost more resources based on how high your crafting skills were? That is basically how the Adventuring XP loss works now. The basic problem with Adventuring XP loss is you have to redo everything you have done and in the case of those with higher level adventuring skills they potentially lose 2 or more hours of adventuring skill points. I wonder how many crafters would like 2 or more hours of their crafting or gathering accomplishments wiped out?

    I would have no problem paying gold each time I died as long as it was not ridiculously high. I would not mind buying a potion that allowed me to escape the xp loss. Either case however would need an exception for new players who need time to build their skills and resources (gold). I do object to any penalty system that requires me to redo several hours worth of work in building my character. In UO I could buy insurance on my armor and weapons which is basically the same as paying gold for my death.

    Basically PvP in this game has the same penalty. The only difference is you pay a ransom to get your items back. In other words GOLD. If PvP players lost their Adventuring Experience every time they died I can guarantee you it would not even last a week.

    I have probably lost enough Adventuring Experience Points since it has been put in to have GM'd 6 or more skills. That is time and skill gain I will never get back. My crime was that I enjoy adventuring solo and with friends. I like to be challenged and try to figure ways to defeat an enemy not just through brute skill use but strategy and tactics. Experience point loss destroys that incentive entirely. Just as punishing Crafting with Producer Experience Loss would do.
     
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