Stealing/Theft/Hiding/Stealth

@ OP a good amount of the people want another Wow or a Wow with Dress up and house Decorating features .... don't get me wrong I love me a house and Options to decorate but I also would like more ....... but that seems to be all we can count on * Out side the Box is something that will not be tolerated here . anything outside the current Norm is frowned upon /Sigh.


* Edited for language - Koldar

 

Such as?

What 'out of the norm' idea are you proposing? I LOVE new ideas, but so far all I am seeing is ideas on how to reproduce the thief abilities from UO. Nothing new, nothing exciting proposed as of yet.

I'm all ears to new ideas as long as they are worded in a manner that won't violate the forum rules.

 

There has been ZERO revealed about stealth/theft, etc... So, you ain't missing anything from anyplace.

Most just like to speculate like they "know"

Hence the "class" Rogue versus Thief.

 

Well IMO Uo's Thief is a place to start . dismissing it as just a reproduction of the UO thief is a bit harsh IMO @Ned88 ,,,, I haven't played a game with a thief sense Uo so If out of the last 10 most popular games only 1 had a thief all others have Paladin,Mage,Warrior. Atleast its not exactly the same ... could it be tweaked maybe but to dismiss it like its the flavor of the month player type is annoying to me . because to me the fighter mage healer is the flavor of every month in every game ...... do i like them ? I do , do they have a place ? Always .. but these classes are like Sight words to us in terms understanding and familiarity Forgive me @ Ned888 Bad day at work so im more pvp oriented tonight .. I am just hopping to connect on something thats not the same ole thing........
Lor

 

That's not a prison, it's a consequence. That would be like the the judge in real life saying "Each time we catch you pickpocketing, the police are going to hold you for another hour longer than the previous time."

The POINT of the prison would be a massive, prohibitive punishment that, in game terms, rendered your character UNPLAYABLE. Cause, let's face it, would YOU tolerate someone coming back and stealing from you OVER AND over and over and ...

It just doesn't make sense. If they are really stealing from the community, and get caught, mere death and resurrection is not going to placate the victims. Again, my issue is with the realism of punishment. Almost by definition, the punishment that will satisfy the VICTIMS of theft, such that they won't insist on pursuing the thief further, will be so severe that the PERPETRATORS of the theft will not find it fun.

The point is that it won't really be a game mechanic.

I can see an argument for the thrill of permadeath thievery, the idea that if you get caught, something so bad is done to you that you have to make a new character. I can imagine some very few people who would want that, but I cannot imagine it satisfying the total playerbase who want in game thieving. If, at the same time, the ramp up to become a skilled thief has to be long enough that we don't have newly made thieves ripping off the high end targets, if it's faster to level a thief and steal the stuff than it is to level up and make/earn the stuff, then the general desire towards gain will favor using theft.

Which is a world I for one won't want to be in.

 

Nobody assumes that PvE is boring.
PvE is boring tho if it is done in a danger-free environment without any risk of losing.

And answering your questions about thieves...there were some nice idea implemented in UO.

Permagrey status, Forensics and so on. Being a thief was never easy.

 

For the players who MUST have an opt in for stealing, i guess i could comprimise and say pvp opt in should count for stealing flagging as well, especially because the person that just got stole from will prolly want to kill the person (if they can) for a chance to reclaim said item

 

That's exactly what the police do when they catch people stealing over and over again (but not in terms of hours, obviously).

If you're dead, can't access any of your items... You're essentially an unplayable character aside from possibly being able to communicate in guild chat or something.

 

1. I never claimed to know anything at all, so your attitude is entirely unwarranted (relating to all of your posts here).
2. I wasn't even speculating about the design. I was bringing up a topic and offering my opinion.
3. I didn't claim any of the ideas were new. I don't know if there are any new ideas to be had. The most likely thing to done would be to take a number of ideas that have already been done and merge them into a new system that the developers think will fit best with the overarching style of gameplay they are attempting to implement.

Did you even play UO? Have you played any games with similar thief mechanics? I'm all ears for any idea from you. Your posts have been 100% negative without any ideas at all.

 

It would have to be a form of Open PvP, so would have to purely by consent. Stealing would be a criminal act, so any thief flagged as a criminal would be attacked by guards in town, and could be attacked by any player anywhere with no penalty whatsoever. One thing that would have to be determined would be the duration of the criminal flag for theft. Bank thieves were a big problem in UO, and it was a bit ridiculous to see the same bank thieves day after day in town, b but they would be immune to attack unless they were flagged for a new theft.

In a game based upon Virtues, I would hope this would not be a mistake to be repeated from UO.

 

Maybe like modern phone notification radio/ check boxes pvp stealing or any criminal act could have its own box and we choose what we are open to that particular day.
Lor

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Bank thieves were annoying, although I sometimes did participate. I liked to snoop just to annoy people even without intent to steal (I was only 10 when I started UO).

I wouldn't be totally opposed to preventing all PvP-theft while in town. Towns, and maybe even dungeons, could be theft-free to ease people's minds... Then you would know you just have to watch yourself while running around outside. This would also probably be helpful for the craftsmen, despite my desire to steal a freshly made katana or two.

Then PvE thieves (or rogues) could run around doing sneaky things inside towns, waiting for NPC's to leave the room, picking locks, etc. all without needing to participate in PvP or worry about combat skills at all if they didn't want to.

 

That's unworkable because I would check the box when I want to go out stealing, and uncheck it whenever I wanted to go do anything else.

 

And that would possibly change or refresh your status? Maybe? We dont know if so you would refresh with othsr like people.

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All good questions. Here's my answers.

You shouldn't, it should be balanced. But it should BE and it has to BE before they can balance it. There are no games with multiplayer stealing, not really. I hope SotA changes that.

I agree with you, death is much of a punishment in a game where you just come back to life. There has to be balance so that the "game" is fair for everyone involved.

Because PVE is boring...for those that don't like PVE.

Great question, that shouldn't happen. We're back to requiring the system has balance.

They don't, which is why they often use alts.

I suppose that would be fun if the traps were complex and dynamic and there was real risk versus reward there. But I haven't see a game like that either.

 

Sounds to me that someone is thinking SotA will be UO again. I hope not. UO is great but we need new stuff.

Thieving, stealth, theft, hiding is not needed.


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Because I enjoyed the stealing aspect of UO, that doesn't mean I think that it should be exactly the same in that regard, or the same game as a whole. There were a lot of problem with UO, and I hope SotA isn't UO with better graphics (and I know it won't be).

Everyone keeps saying "new stuff," and it's really annoying because none of them have any idea what that means, whether it's pve, pvp, stealing, game mechanics, or anything else...

If there has been some technological advancement that allows for a better and more balanced system in any of the above mentioned areas, I am all for them trying to implement that. When it comes down to it though, you can't have an immersive experience without the bad guys.

What do you want? Diablo III? Pick your character. Smash a few buttons. Grab loot. Tell people you're cool?

For me, and a lot of other people, you have to have some competition beyond the ideas of the developers and the difficulty settings. That competition is only available online, and through PVP (combat at a minimum, and preferably with theft). UO achieved as much as it did because it allowed people to interact in a way they never had been able to before. I hope that SotA does the same.

Edit: "...are not needed*"

 

See, if the repeat death penalty for stealing was YEARS, like in real life, I wouldn't mind. "You stole 500 gold, you are a repeat offender, your account is banned for two years." Any takers? *I do believe we have an effective system of punishment!*

My point, however, is that it won't be. Any punishment levied against thieves in game will literally be balanced against the fun or loss thereof to the thief, and with that, it becomes an ineffective punishment.

An effective punishment is one that stops the offending behavior. That IS the point of punishment. Just because we've all seen lots and lots of punishments that were NOT effective doesn't mean that model should be followed.

Pretty sure ned was talking to someone else, so what you were claiming, or speculating, is kinda irrelevant to his post. Someone jumped out and said something that offended him, he called that guy out on some bad logic.

 

[quote="Zifnab Strongarm, post: 81867, member: 18032", you can't have an immersive experience without the bad guys.

What do you want? Diablo III? *"[/quote]

Bad guys? That is what the NPC and monsters are for

Diablo III? Sorry, I don't play Diablo. Never have, never will.


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Thieving, stealth, theft and hiding is needed if the game is a RPG with virtues. Having a possibility to achieve a negative virtue is just as important as achieving positive virtue.

Without the bad guys there wont be a complete game as i see it.