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Supple & Hardened Leather Nerfed?

Discussion in 'Release 26 Feedback Forum' started by Mysticvermin, Feb 19, 2016.

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  1. Mysticvermin

    Mysticvermin Avatar

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    I noticed today that it's been a lot tougher in areas that I can normally handle easy. I thought that this was mostly due to the extreme lag that I've been experiencing since the since the patch. I just finished putting an emerald in my chest when I saw it and I had to double check it. Instead of the 40% weapon damage it now reads 4%. All total the hardened leather set dropped from 100% weapon damage to 10%. I checked the supple leather set I have and low and behold, dropped from 40% weapon critical chance to 4%. Ouch!!! Now why in the hell am I wearing leather instead of plate? Damn good question.
     
  2. Lord Dreamo

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    Cause it's far more comfortable and fashion forward.
     
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  3. uziraff

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    Well good to hear i'm not crazy. I was talking about the values of my armor with a guild mate, and when I looked at my armor I was like no wonder the bears are beating the crap out of me tonight!
     
  4. Noric

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    Considering the values were kind of high a nerf might be appropriate. Not sure if this might be an overnerf though..
     
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  5. Curt

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    It's a matter on how much of a characters power should depends on skills and how much on gear.
    in the well known game World of Warcraft depends the power quite a lot on Gear.
    How do we want it to depend here?
     
  6. Oba Evesor

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    The knee-jerk reaction to the OP gear was to go too far in the other direction.
    I don't wear leather, I wear plate. The 40% was OP, BUT it shouldn't be 4% for leather! My Constantine heavy chest is 4%. The Archers should get like 20% on their leather chest.
    It baffles me some of these changes mid-release, w/no patch notes. They changed Chaotic Feedback after folks had leveled it and Life together. That's not viable anymore with the -250 life attune now associated with feedback. (btw this change just made Death much stronger while hurting the other folks).
    A lot of people have leveled light armor innates for the new gear and now they have to switch to heavy to get the same weapon dmg bonus (4% for both) , but better dmg resist.

    There hasn't been one aspect of the game not broken this release. From crafting materials to economy to combat, its all kinds of wacky right now. Shame, folks getting frustrated w/'play-testing' a system that doesn't seem to getting better each release.
     
  7. Noric

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    I would argue that this instance isn't really about that because of the existence of both heavy and light armor. The light armor bonuses entirely outclassed those of heavy earlier this release. Now they are in line with heavy (and I agree that they should probably be slightly better than heavy to offset resist differences.)
     
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  8. agra

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    Similar to patch notes in all other fantasy-themed persistent multi-player online games, the developers don't put nerfs in the patch notes because it would make them accountable, transparent, and honest.

    Also the whole "people have leveled a and now have to switch to b"? That's going to be going on throughout the entire life of this title. It's unavoidable for one simple reason: The developers do not have effective hard caps in place for all effects. If they did, and they published them ahead of time as overarching design goals, then there would be fewer "surprise! you're nerfed!" moments.
    What do I mean by hard caps? A completely hypothetical/fictional example:

    Until EP2, these are the current hard caps for combat effects:
    Haste: 20%
    Snare: 75%
    CC Duty Cycle: 20%
    Single Target Stun Duration: 3 seconds
    Single Target Mez Duration: 6 seconds
    Base Weapon Dmg Bonus: 50%
    Proc Damage Bonus: 10%
    Run Speed Buff: 50%
    Weapon Range Increase: 20%
    DD DPS: 300
    DoT DPS: 100
    Direct HPS: 200
    Regen HPS: 50


    Which would mean, for example, that no matter what, if your weapon had 10 base damage, the most it could ever be buffed to would be 15, no matter the combination of gear, potions, and temporary buff spells. Similarly, even if you had Greater Haste on two weapons, and used Berserk or whatever other combat skill, you could never reach more than 20% haste in practice.

    Hard caps act as a safety net, to prevent runaway exploits or unintended behavior. It's apparent that at the moment, either there are no such hard caps, or they're set far too high. This is normal for a game not in production, but if it's not rectified prior to July 28th, 2016, it will once again be a bad day/month/year for the development team. As it has been for all other development teams & games that didn't have hard caps in production. (EQ being the first, and many since)
     
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  9. Noric

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    I think it is even simpler than that. Balance changes happen. They happen in most online games and will always happen. Granted I think they might be well served to hurry up and implement the deleveling feature as balance changes with attunement provide a pretty compelling reason for it.
     
  10. agra

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    Yes, balance changes happen, but with hard caps, people don't care as much. Without them, people care... a lot. That invested emotional reaction never serves anyone well, in the long term.
    But agreed, it would be great to get all the XP back that players invested in what is now 'nerfed'; it would soften the blow, so to speak.
     
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  11. Weins201

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    So a balance was put in for armor, but now "hard caps" are mentioned, really? The sky is not falling it was a minor adjustment, like the +500% range bonus.

    If balance is achieved ideas like this don't exist and shouldn't even be mentioned as it has NEVER been discussed by developers anywhere, so breaching that subject . . . . .
     
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  12. agra

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    Balance is never achieved.
    All MMO's eventually put in hard caps. It's one disaster after another until they're put in place. History, it teaches!
     
  13. Malcipher

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    we noticed this last night during our stream, I went from a crit archer to a . . . Archer with a handful of "RUN AWAY" , we went from upper level content in the adventure level 50ish area to not being able to fight some of the mobs reliably anymore as the damage output wasn't there. From my understanding this nerf was due to PVP'ers "2 shotting" each other, I don't mind nerfing pvp if it is being silly but nerfing pve at the same time is a little harsh.

    why not have a specific armor or some other stat that allows pvp to be more player controlled, like armor stats like some kind of lower crit chance or damage or resist spells. this way the pve aspect is preserved and not as effected by pvp since it is now player option and responsibility to setup one of the quick change sets to pve and the other to pvp for either situation making more use of another in-game feature and its related skills

    I'm going to post this idea else where so I can elaborate on this further. . .
     
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  14. Noric

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    I think you might be oversimplifying the situation. You were with all likelihood facing monsters that before this release would have been considered out of your capacity(given adventurer level). Aside from the PvP aspect of the nerf, it is also addressing the imbalance between light and heavy armor PVEers at the time.
     
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  15. agra

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    Mm mm. Nothing like a tasty pve nerf for the sake of pvp. Good times.
     
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  16. Themo Lock

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    The stats on many of the new gear recipes were wrong and are getting fixed, gear is not meant to increase damage output by 400%. It took time to thoroughly test all the gear and discover the mistakes. As with any new feature it was unlikely to be perfect on first implementation. Leather now has similar bonus numbers to cloth and metal, so the ranged skills themselves can be adjusted without testing being skewed by broken gear.
     
  17. NRaas

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    What ?!? My 40% Critical Chance hath been nerf-ed ?

    How dare ? :D
     
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  18. Ancev

    Ancev Bug Hunter

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    On the bright side, the backside critical strike issue was addressed. (This might have been only affecting certain weapons, not sure. )

    Some "misses" were introduced while attacking monsters from the front side, which is how it should be. This affects auto-attack and free attack, so I was glad to see there was no favoritism between the two. You can root your opponent and move to their backside to get more consecutive successful hits.

    Although it could be argued that certain powers such as confusion and stun effects should negate or reduce this front side defensive bonus. Haven't tested this yet.
     
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  19. NRaas

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    On a more serious note though : I'm not particularly impressed that the change went in as a "Stealth" patch.

    Would have been better played by having a line item in the Patch Notes.

    But whatever, still a work-in-progress. :)
     
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  20. Daxxe Diggler

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    I agree that the 40% crit needed to be nerfed, it was clearly not intended to be raised that high simply with gear. Perhaps the nerf was a bit too drastic and should be bumped up just a bit to account for the lower damage resists compared to heavy armors... but that's something that can be further corrected in a future patch after some testing at what it is now.

    However, my big problem is that any changes like this (especially those as drastic as this one was) should be included in the patch notes. We all know this is the first implementation of the new armor recipes and material bonuses... so everyone would understand that an obvious OP situation needed to be fixed. So I don't see any reason to make it a ninja nerf.

    Most of us are here to help balance the game and completely understand changes like this are necessary to do that. But don't keep us in the dark about the fixes please! Let us know when the changes happen so when we log in we're not so surprised about them. ;)
     
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