Poll: PVP or PVE - Which Are You? [UNOFFICIAL]

Someone has to craft, for that reason resources are required. If atoms are not crafted then they cannot be sold and therefore items cannot be replaced. Simple Economics - scarce resources and infinite wants.

In general more danger = better items. You could argue to have all the good and useful items/resources in safe and plentiful locations. these items although "useful" will become cheap. The high price items will be less useful but more rare...... Once again simple economics.

To craft better items.

I don't really understand your question, but if you make money you will be able to buy a house and whatever is available to decorate it. With the right resources you may even be able to craft your own decorations.

People tend go like cosmetic items. People like rare items and to show them off in their houses. Trading rare items is also a good way to make money (what is not rare now could be rare in the future).

Equipment is never meaningless. Certain items will be better than others.

It is always cheaper to repair than to buy or craft new.

Why would be as effective nude?

I quite agree, why should people care about player looting. People should never carry more than they can effort to lose.

Banks tend to be available in most towns and cities and is a good way to keep items safe especially if the player does not own a house.

Either used them to craft and sold what I crafted or sold the resources if I was not skilled in the required craft.

No one should ever be that bothered about dying, for me it is a certainty within the game so why should a known factor bother me.

I assume you are aiming the "Counter Strike" and "Cowboys and Indians" at PvPers. As a fan of traditional fantasy RP games I expect you are will skilled in PvM.... PvP is very similar except you don't play vs a computer with predictable AI..... You play against another person.

Everyone has their own likes and dislikes in games such as this, the nice thing is that the content is so huge you are able to decide what you actually want to do. If you want to craft nice high end armer then do it, have a vendor and make some money. Others may wish to go hunting in dungeons......others may wish to go hunt the people who go hunting in dungeons.......others may with to hunt the people who want to kill the people who go dungeon hunting.

In a nutshell if you don't like or understand PvP then avoid it. Believe me there will be more people faming resources and people protecting those people than there will ever be PKs.

 

I predict that there will be tons of people with PVP turned off, enjoying the story of the game with like minded adventurers while all the PKers run around wondering where all the prey is at.
You know, on UO, Felucca looks like a barren wasteland for a reason, right?

You guys did that to yourselves.

The Trammel/Felucca option already exists here. There's no waiting years for the game to have it implemented. Given how UO turned out, what do you think most people will choose now?

 

Look at the poll!
PvP guys are the majority!
We should have a fully PvP game without the pvp/non pvp flag option!
/thread

 

Felucca was not a wasteland after trammel was introduced.

There were more PvP players then ever after the split. UO Renaissance was the best time in felucca and that contradicts your statement that felucca died cause of PK:s.

PK:s were actually very few after statloss was introduced. PvP players on the other hand were increasing day by day after Renaissance was introduced and was still very strong all the way up to Age of Shadows that WoW-ified UO and emptied felucca.

It was the making of UO just another WoW game that killed the hardcore game we knew as oldschool felucca UO.

I believe they could have kept 1 shard if they instead of creating trammel had made consequences for PK:s abit harder.

But we never know since they took what they thought was the best financial way and created trammel and divided the community.

 

I enjoy both. What I enjoy most is a game that seamlessly intertwines the two. I like playing capture the flag but prefer it be called what it is. I like pking (not griefing) and PK hunting. That said I do find many PVE storylines boring or repetitive.

There should be no separation between world story (general story) and PVE or PVP. The story should be able to hold them all inside it.

I want to see RP encouraged equally in PVP and PVE.

 

Not immediately after, no. But eventually, yes.

No it doesn't. UO Renaissance was the end of Felucca, which was basically when people slowly migrated to Trammel. This includes moving houses, realizing that PvP really was not as fun as it used to be for many reasons, and other things. It was basically the last big hoorah for PKs and PVPers before many people said "screw this!"

Felucca definitely devolved into a wasteland after Trammel where the only people still there were like, botters and hackers. Everyone who wanted to play the game for its social, adventurous aspects migrated to Trammel, and it's still like that to this day. It was not an overnight thing. UO:R just gave people the means to finally get out of the riff-raff and enjoy the game without hurting people.

UO started turning bad before WoW came out, as evidenced by the fact that AOS came out before WoW. People were tired of griefing. The new AOS style stat system also completely gooned up PVP for a bit. Everyone had to kind of relearn how to do things effectively.



For anyone who's curious:
http://www.uoguide.com/Ultima_Online:_Renaissance
http://www.uoguide.com/Trammel

 

Felucca became a wasteland after Age of Shadows which changed the game entirely with its insurance, gearbased PvP and new skills. I was there from beta and know this from first experience on first Atlantic and then Europe shard. All PvP guilds left felucca when it became a WoW game with Age of Shadows.

UO Renaissance improved PvP with its special hits that gave dexers a good chance to compete, game was more PvP balanced and it was UO feluccas finest time. Why should PvP players leave a game that had improved, make no sense whatsoever. And as i said, all my friends in the different PvP clans stayed after trammel and all left after Age of Shadows with it's WoW gameplay. I have no clue why you're trying to rewrite UO history? Dont it fit into a description of full loot PvP and PK:ing being a failure whereever it were tried maybe? It was a huge success during UO renaissance.

The one that introduced Age of Shadows was actually the lead designer of WoW, Tom Chilton, and thats why we can see the similarities with it's insurance system and gearbased PvP. UO PvP players actually played the same game during Renaissance as they started to play in -97. The PvP system was even improved during Renaissance. Age of Shadows on the other hand totally changed the game into a WoW game and that was why felucca PvP players left, they didnt recognize the game they played for 6 years, it had become a totally different PvP game, and that's why UO felucca died.

UO renaissance was playerskill at it's best. There havent been a more skillbased PvP MMO game afterwards. And the amazing part is that it was autotarget based.

Your say PvP wasnt as fun for "many reasons"?

Can you please point out those reasons?

Special hits made the game alot more interesting and gave a just about perfect balance btw dexers and mages. So that cant be it.

Spellsystem was just about the same, wrestlestun was only overpowered in gank situations just as special hits was, so that cant be it.

UO subscribers increased all the way to some 2 months after AoS and then rapidly decreased. A huge reason for that was that felucca became a wasteland after Age of Shadows.

 

I cant believe someone out there other than me is actually being brutally honest about killing the weak! Most Pro full loot PvPer's dont admit to it. Especially when people against full loot say something like "you just want weak victims to slaughter because your antisocial!".

 

Since Selective Multitasking should also match skill sets and levels, you guys will just have to be content with kicking the family dog.

 

NPC humans are funner.

 

It was starting to trickle off on GL and Legends with LBR from what I remember. AOS kind of just sealed the deal.

I am not trying to rewrite it. I even said UOR was the last big hoorah. It was all downhill from there.

It's still not correct to say people left because it felt like WoW, considering that WoW wasn't out at the time to give people that feeling...in retrospect you can see that this is basically what happened, but at the time, it was just a really gear oriented system that made people act like idiots so they could get neon orange tunics and dayglo green chainmail pants. It removed the need for skill (both playerbased, and character based). I remember a friend starting with AOS and I gave him some GM valorite armor / katana, and he was walking through Shame with no problem, 10 minutes in. I remember running in terror from an ogre 10 minutes into my first UO experience, because I was wearing NPC chainmail and couldn't hit to save my life.

and, I also said AOS's new system gooned PVP up, so I think we are in agreement there.

Once things started to trickle off, we definitely saw more people cheating. When you have gank mobs that are all cheating, it quickly turned into "if you can't beat em, join em, or go to Trammel"


You'd have people follow you into a dungeon with stealth, block the entrance with crates, pop up and start blasting you with all of their fancy foofoo programs, and then laugh when you'd try to take off and run into their crate-wall.

It's clever, but I don't really respect PVPers who rely on third party programs to get the job done.

The new gear system made PVP kind of annoying, too. Too much crap to deal with. That new AOS style stat system was just annoying in general. I was never a fan of it.

 

Lot of good conversation going on here... I think its worth noting that while i voted for PVP, consensual or not, i generally prefer to play pvm / pve with a group of friends or be a crafter, and not partake in larger group battles or PKing, etc - however i truly loved the risk/reward feeling that pre-renaissance UO had. In T2A simply going TO the dungeon could be an adventure, possibly encountering a troupe of PKs. It felt rewarding. I'd say the system wasn't perfect, but T2A era UO had it the most figured out, in my opinion - and i would happily up my pledge considerably if i knew for sure there was a pvp style similar to what was around then - that offered players the chance to be the bad guys, which generated not only a nice risk and reward feeling for the successful PKs, but also to the players who survived or avoided their attacks.

 

I can't help but wondering sometimes if the "exciting glory days" of full PvP, pre-split UO are somewhat akin to the way people are remembered as practically saints after they pass on... a glorified, rose-tinted-glasses hindsight, rather than how things really were.

Just a thought.

 

I remember it just as it was and it still is the by far best MMO ever created.

What happened to that wonderful game is nothing but a game tragedy. EA destroyed the best game ever created in the hope for some fast money.

Followers of that game have searched for a replacement ever since and still havent found it, which is just as tragic.

Hoped for SotA to be the replacer.

 

I belong to the

Dead PvP Society.



We vowed not to talk about PvP anymore until the Developers give us something to talk about.

 

Don't take this the wrong way:

What part of "we're not making an MMO" in that initial video, followed by the "not really an MMO" and "storydriven with single player options" stuff made you think SotA would be the replacement for an open-ended, basically storyless sandbox game with hardly any rules behind it?

UO Happened. It came and went. It was great. However, the newness of it is gone. Things have advanced in many ways. While some parts of it were great and need to be revisited, some things need to just stay where they were because time proved that it's not what most really wanted out of the game.

Players ruined UO. Enough people did terrible things to other players that it all added up and people got tired of it. They went to Trammel, or they left. EA did some really dumb things, but really, player attitude drove enough people away from Felucca that it helped nail the coffin shut. It's easy to blame EA, but really, it should be just as easy to blame all of the people who helped make Felucca a giant chore to walk around.

It wasn't "oh, I am going out on an adventure, I better be prepared for anything! This will be great!" anymore. It was "ugh, I have to go to Felucca. Here come the natives."

Turn on razor, fire up the auto-bandaid buttons and whatever else helps you stay on par with the gankinators, and enjoy the ride. You're probably going to get killed.

and then killed again.

and again.

and again.

All so you can maybe get some powerscrolls or whatever. It's really funny when you have someone standing there using Exorcism.

Does that sound like a fun adventure to you? It doesn't sound like a fun one to me. It sounds like work.


I also honestly question how much those of you who seem to advocate wanting it really want it, anyways.

What is stopping you from going to the multitude of free UO shards with rules like you like them, full of like minded people?

It's better than it was. It's free now! You can party like its 1999 with more people than what you're probably going to end up encountering on SotA once people are situated. I've played on a few of them for a bit. They are pretty great. Definitely worth getting into. One of them (T2A!) even lets you type to the NPCs. I think OSI official shards shut that down AWHILE ago.

It's like you've all been handed the keys to a time machine and are too busy griping about "back in my day" to get in the thing and go back to your day.


I don't mean this as "Shut up and go away". I mean this as, what you want is already there. Go get it. Let's let SotA turn into what it's going to be, instead of hoping and trying to turn it into something it never claimed it was going to be.

 

UO is not the only PvP game that has ever existed. For my part, I've played in many others since. The proof will come in the beta test when the dev's start testing PvP.

 

I think the appeal of UO lies in it's fully sandbox qualities, its lack of rules. Like watching early Ultimate Fighting. Suddenly no groin strikes, no eye gouges, different sport. Elite players leave. Better as a publicly accessible sport? Yes.

SotA is poised to create a very organic community bc of its lack of restriction. History has shown what laws must needs be enforced in order to grow our society.

 

Played UO freeshards since Age of Shadows killed UO felucca and those freeshards are just about dead now.

Played just about all of them that wasnt US based and they were great fun but never as fun as the original game cause that original felucca had more players and was AAA developer founded. Freeshards also had so many cheaters that removed the feel of fair competition.

A new UO with a rulesetting as old felucca as an option is all i want.

My guild have played all promising MMO games from Darkfall, Mortal Online and on and on but they are lightyears away from that old game we learned to love.

Today we have no game to play that fit our old playstyle, all have been searching many years for that replacer.

And i disagree that the players destroyed felucca. The bonds that were knit during those felucca years still hold. The friends i met in UO are still my guildmates after +10 years which says alot about that game.

Many in my guild have met real life even though they werent living in the same country, my sons went from Sweden to Germany to meet with some of the guildies which says alot about the friendship bonds that were found during those UO years.

EA destroyed UO - it was definetly not the players. Age of Shadows created by EA made us all log into a game we didnt recognice and why should we old felucca players continue to play a game that had turned into a completely different game? Gearbased and with insurance, no risk vs reward or consequences. That killed off UO felucca.

Well we didnt but i and the friends i found in UO are still waiting for a replacer to that old game.

 

Your bonds knit during Felucca times may still hold, but others were relieved at Trammel, and possibly the escape from you and your friends from Felucca!

There really is a reason so many people up and went there. I'm pretty sure Trammel and insurance was added as a direct result of people disliking how brutal the game could turn out for you.

Anyway:

http://www.uosecondage.com/ << 281 people on! About as many as a real server!

http://uoforever.com/ << Solid newcomer. If I wasn't busy playing all these PS3 games I bought, and working on programming games too, I would still be playing around on here.