What I'm getting out of this thread if I brain-filter all the !!angry!! is: The current guild war system is not fit for purpose. Reasons: The "war flag" can be avoided via various means (some of which are questionably exploitative) The "war flag" encompasses an entire guild and is the decision of a guild leader to put his/her guild members 'at risk' Could negatively impact guilds that welcome players of all levels/playstyles especially since PvP death includes 'financial loss of stuff So I think the first step would be to define - What should a Guild War mean? Does it mean all players with a guild tag should be flagged all of the time, wherever they go, should be prevented from playing in private mode for the duration of the war, should be unable to unflag via any means (including party invites, oracle, etc.)? (Basically, it becomes an Open PvP game for the war participants with no recourse). It sounds like this is what is being asked for. If we accept the above premise, and the flagging issues get resolved, we need to figure out a way to deal with the following: 1. Going into private/locked residences /basements using such as a base of operations / safe place If this is seen as something we don't want to happen, how would we propose to avoid it with the current game mechanics? It seems to me that this would all be valid in a 'war' scenario but this behavior has been pointed out as (pick an adjective...cowardly, dishonorable, not sporting, whatever). Making sweeping changes to game mechanics (ie, you can't zone while in combat) complicates other aspects of gameplay. Can't zone while PvP flagged...might work. But are we really saying we don't want people to go into their own house if someone's chasing them? Or log off? 2. Further game mechanics issues (such as banning people from towns) Again, limiting this feature has other affects outside the Guild War / PvP space, so how would we solve this problem for the war context? It seems to me that the above two points are going to be a significant obstacle to the type of 'war' that is wanted. Instead it may be prudent to encourage the narrowing of the battlefield by giving guild wars some sort of zone/arena/thing with objectives in it, rather than trying to make it a world-spanning affair where people are hunted outside their homes, killed while zoning in to places, etc. Otherwise the amount of technical changes that would be required to create the 'fair battle' are a pretty long list and getting all of it changed would likely not be something that could happen quickly. All of the issues pointed out seem to be people trying to avoid the fight. In a fully consensual war, where both sides have said "yes, lets have war!" ...why is this even happening? Is it people don't want to be bothered while they're trying to do something other than PvP? is it ransom costs? As a side note, if it weren't for ransoms, there'd be little reason not to stand and fight. Should we consider that ransom is a discourager to pvp participation and perhaps deactivate it for wars and come up with some other way of keeping score? I've often heard people say the money they get from ransoms is not much, its no big deal, its nothing, they often give it back / don't claim it ....alright then, why have it? If the goal here is to have fun, engaging pvp in which many people participate I'd say removing barriers to entry would be a good start.