This Flag System is disincentivizing PVP

Discussion in 'PvP Gameplay' started by Xail, Mar 18, 2016.

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  1. Xail

    Xail Avatar

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    People not flagged for PVP will ALWAYS have the initiative in a fight against flagged people...in other words who is flagged is ALWAYS at disadvantage in a fight against non flagged people...

    No wonder there are people that like PVP but do not flag...and people that like PVP that put the flag off...it is of course a vicious loop.
     
  2. Alexander_Cornfellow

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    Why? I don't understand. Would you mind providing some more detail? Why will "People not flagged for PVP will ALWAYS have the initiative in a fight against flagged people". By 'initiative' do you mean advantage?

    Thanks for the clarification,
    Cornfellow
     
  3. Xail

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    Hi, by initiative I mean an unflagged player can attack a flagged one...but not the opposite...I strongly suggest to flag and see for yourself in game.
     
  4. Kara Brae

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    It would interest me to know: is this just a possible problem or is it already a real problem? Are people who are flagged for PVP being surprised attacked on a regular basis? If so, are the attackers always the same people?
     
  5. Xail

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    There are people like me that used to be always flagged...that of course are not flagged...and if you speak with them they will give you the same reasoning...it is pretty obvious I guess...
     
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  6. Alexander_Cornfellow

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    Being old and stooped and not a PVP'r, I still don't understand. If I'm not flagged and I attack someone that is flagged, do I then get a flag? And being flagged, doesn't that identify one as an 'outlaw' who should be open to attack by a law abiding citizen. Maybe I shouldn't be in this conversation at all because the mechanics mystify me.

    Cheers,
    Cornfellow
     
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  7. Ristra

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    What I am hearing you say is there is a fear of getting attacked.

    That doesn't go away. You either learn to be ready or you don't.

    Being able to attack first by making everyone flagged isn't the solution to your problem. Unless you problem is you want to be able to attack anyone and everyone.
     
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  8. Xail

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    You are hearing very wrong...as usual...
     
  9. Ice Queen

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    I haven't bothered with pvp in this game for a long time now, it just seems more suited for pve. I rarely see anyone that's pvp, but I think the situation the OP is talking about is an easy fix. If you're unflagged and decide to flag yourself pvp, you're pvp now but have 10 seconds before you can attack or be attacked. That puts both you and the person you were going to ninja attack on equal footing.
     
  10. Smalls

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    Let me help clarify this for Xail. He like's PVP the human engagement where your not sure the out come of the battle since it is not a scripted AI he is fighting against. Now there are a few ways to enter into this part of the game. First is by going to the oracle and dropping your protection. (this gives you the PVP flag) which makes you openly attackable by anyone (even if they aren't currently flagged for pvp). By going into a dedicated PVP zone which makes everyone in the zone attackable. Now those of us who really enjoy pvp will usually flag our self and stay flagged. Here is where it gets tricky. I am flagged fighting a group of NPC mobs. and joey comes running over the hill sees im flagged and decides that since he knows he cant kill me in a regular battle now is the time to strike. Oh by the way joey isn't flagged for pvp. So he kills me, takes my corpse costs me 2000 gold because he happened to get my weapon and 100 chaos chips and I need my weapon back so I pay the ransom. Joey now runs out the zone to drop his pvp flag ( you lose it when you zone if you aren't flagged at the oracle). Then runs back into zone seeing me again and laughing how he just PwnTDogged me. Nothing I can do about it...
     
  11. Kara Brae

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    What I am trying to understand is, does this happen a lot?
     
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  12. HogwinHD

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    Look, Fact is , its simple, when you flag for PVP, you are making a conscious decision to allow yourself to be open to attack. therefore you deal with the consequences. END OF :)
     
  13. Smalls

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    Oh I don't mind it, and you know this Mr john.. althou I can see where to some people it just shows the weakness of those who do it. That is why pvp will never really succeed in this game. Because you don't have to allow yourself to be attackable you just have to attack those who do. It is one sided, and geared towards the pve crowd. But sadly there isn't much in the way of pve atm. Got bored at lvel 70.. here I am 80 still beating on the same spiders.. hardened elves and the corpion twice a day. wash rince repeat. starting to get a bit yawny...
     
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  14. Ice Queen

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    That's usually how it goes in pvp in most games, people always jump you when you're killing mobs because you're an easier kill. I've had that done to me countless times in other games. That's just how it goes when I play on a pvp server in other games, it's part of the danger. I don't see forcing everyone to be flagged pvp would help this situation at all. People will always feel they have the advantage of killing you when you are fighting mobs. What's fun is when they do that and you still beat the crap out of them. Most of the time when I'm jumped even on high level characters when out leveling I still beat the person that thought it would be a good idea to jump me while killing mobs. People that do it aren't usually all that great at pvp anyways and you can usually beat them as long as your health isn't at a sliver. Like when I played DAOC and Wow, you could always tell when someone was crappy at pvp, they'd go beat up on your low level alts because they would be 1 or two shotted. I'd always have my maxed out characters logged out where my lowbie was, come back and kill the griefer relentlessly until they just ended up leaving their body on the ground and give up. People will always go after you when you're fighting mobs, just part of pvp.
     
  15. radddaaa

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    İ did not see anyone on the game doing pvp.
     
  16. Halvard

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    Though that wasn't the problem as I understood it. I have no objection to a good backstabbing but if I can't take revenge on the guy (because he wasn't flagged) then there is no reason for anyone to flag and all pvp dies.

    This is why the flag should be a permanent choice when creating your character and blues can stay blue forever (in this scenario an un flagged can't attack a flagged person)
     
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  17. Weins201

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    Two issues here but basically the same thing, Initiative is NOT always an advantage, if you get jumped and lose , they you are not prepared to fight and should NOT be flagged. If you are flagged then you always need to be prepared to fight.

    Look at the video someone made while fighting with a friend in a Shard Fall, they where just in there fighting Elemental and a guy ran in a killed them both, Was that infair also. Do not say it is not the same thing it is EXACTLY the same thing, you are in a PvP zone you ALWAYS have to e ready. same as if oyu are flagged.

    NOW the second issues is what REALLY needs to be addressed - - - - If a Non PvP players "jumps" a PvP players or joins a PvP fight they need to be flagged PvP for 7 real life days . . . . . .!!!!! Not leave the instance and the flag wears off.

    They made a conscious fight to engage in PvP they need to be MADE PvP for a time. I say 7 days or 5 In Game Days ((( ONLINE DAYS )))) no t log out anD sit back let it expire and come back into the.

    THE DECESION TO PvP NEEDS TO HAVE CONSEQUENCES OTHER THAN LEAVE THE INSTANCE AND BE SAFE!!!
     
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  18. Womby

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    That appears to be the problem. PVP players who are openly flagged are forced to allow allow PVP players who are not flagged to always take the first shot. I imagine that if that first shot is something like root then it could turn into several unanswered shots. Therefore players don't flag themselves for PVP, because it places them at a significant disadvantage. The result is that now there are very few people flagged for PVP. That means PVP is more likely to be restricted to PVP zones where explicit flagging is not required. That certainly makes it less visible.
     
  19. Smalls

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    This. ^^ my answer is to remove the ability to attack a flagged person if you are not flagged. Why is it even an option? If you want to pvp flag, or enter a pvp zone. You shouldn't be allowed to play the game if you aren't in the same sport.
     
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  20. Fister Magee

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    We should be able to heal random ppl (and other buffs) in nonpvp mode.
    We should be safe from first attack from nonpvp players if we are flagged pvp.
    Nonpvp should be flagged for a week as suggested above by Weins201, if they do not change how a nonpvp player can jump a pvp...

    Am I able to resurrect anyone if I'm nonpvp? Or just members of my party?
     
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