Upcoming Economic Balance Changes

I don't know. I don't know that reducing the price by 1000g would sell anything, I don't know that reducing the price by 2000g would sell anything. What I do know is that the cost is 11% per experiment that I'll never get back, and that's what discourages me from experimenting with my prices. Not experimenting costs me nothing.

 

Before I put too much more work into this idea.... would anybody in this thread be interested in something like this?

It's an alternative to the Public Vendors that attempts to address some of the issues raised earlier. Not by any means meant to be a perfect solution, but think of it more like an experiment of sorts.

(Please PM me with your feedback, so as not to derail this thread or clutter up the other one.)

 

These additional gold sources are a good start, but for the Oracle and Town crier items I have one Question

"How does this benefit game engagement?"

Static rewards that are non farmable are a good way to provide relief to the non power players, but it's a missed opportunity to leverage the systems in place that players should be engaged with.

Instead of 'Speak to the Oracle and recieve 500g' Why not implement a quest in the world?

"Speak to the Oracle and then demonstrate your Courage by killing 10 undead in [location]" Chuck in maybe one per NPC Town for now and add more to rotate and provide some variety. Even if you start with one, it engage the player and gives a justification for the rewards.

For the town crier, instead of registering Outlanders, why not demand labour for the newcomers and request wood, ore, hides or plants? Give gatherers and crafters a way to earn that gold through the gameplay and leave the 500g for combat. They could travel from town to town providing their service and gain the gold and nbot need to draw a sword to earn money for fuel.

'Get gold buttons' are such a wasted opportunity.

 

just keep nerfing us, you can't derail our money train

 

事實上所謂的10%和90%比例，正確說法應該是在DEV時期肯努力玩遊戲和偶爾上線摸兩下聊天或是OB後才加入的玩家的經濟差距
這遊戲的錢沒有你想的那麼難賺，只有想不想賺的差別而已。

如果要更進一步的說明
會造成現在經濟問題的罪魁禍首其實就是官方
4個最大影響的點就是...
1.不論採收或生產都需要花費時間讀取
2.批量製作物品最高上限一次也只能做20個
3.再加上製成成品的NPC賣價和成本相距甚遠
4.不管是低等怪物和高等怪物掉落的物品和金幣價格都差不多
因為這四點所以才造成現在經濟極度不平衡的原因
如果照官方的調整來走
後面勢必會發生V型化經濟
也就是單純走生產和拼命練功的高等玩家經濟最好
但是兼職玩家或是一天玩不了幾小時的休閒玩家經濟會變成最差
這樣根本不算是種平衡
比較合理的做法應該是針對遊戲難度和玩家階段去做調整
包含
【生產系方面】
1.縮短生產系在製作或是採收資源時的讀取時間
2.工具最大耐久度提高到1000並提高批量製作數量上限
3.使用批量製作時才需要製作時間讀取時間
【戰鬥系方面】
依照怪物難度等級調整戰利品剩餘耐久度與金幣掉落數量
例如以50級為一個單位做調整
1~50級的怪物掉落的戰利品剩餘耐久度與金幣掉落數量維持現況不變
51~100級的怪物掉落的戰利品剩餘耐久度與金幣掉落數量是現在的1.5或2倍
101級以上的怪物掉落的戰利品剩餘耐久度與金幣掉落數量是現在的2.5或3倍
BOSS的怪物掉落的戰利品剩餘耐久度與金幣掉落數量是現在的5或10倍

雖然這種調整方式會小幅影響到物價上漲
但是卻同時可以兼顧到生產系、戰鬥系、兼職類玩家、休閒玩家各種需求
因為生產花費時間變短了
低階級武器裝備成本費用會下降很多
但是因為生產時間縮短，玩家就會花較多時間去製造高品質武器裝備
因此高品質武器裝備成本費用會提高許多
低等級玩家不怕沒錢買裝備
高等級玩家也有錢去買裝備
生產系玩家也可以從中得利
這才合乎平衡經濟效應

 

[Quote was removed by Berek]

I don't understand your standpoint, though I've really tried. There is a playing style and levelling-up strategy that enables people with good combat skills to amass great wealth (gold) in the game and it is independent of pledge level or real world money spent. Having like-minded friends in the game who all work together in unison accelerates the wealth acquisition.

I am really glad to have some simple chores to complete in order to earn a bit of gold. When I return home from hours of scrounging reagents in beginner areas to refill my supply cache, I have amassed no fortune and no experience, but I had fun. I see other folks racing through 5 skull areas slaughtering everything in sight and leaving the bodies to rot to gain exp, then spending hours hitting a gustball to level up in order to be able to spend weeks in dangerous mines. That appears to be a popular way to earn gold. This went on even before COTOs were introduced. Even if I had the combat skills to do that it isn't my idea of fun.

 

RL I would agree with you. However, this is a game and it's freaking easy for a player to find it "not fun" and going away. I can celebrate the creativity, yet I am not they mom. They are likely running the game and that, I won't celebrate.

The game is still out of balance, devs have failed so far on creating a working economy. It's hard, very few games have achieved it. But lets hope, and wait for a new, better, release.

 

Here - as in many other games - the first rule is: Time is money.
But as a casual player you do not have much time.

How is it with me? Between work + 4 hours daily travel, tasks to do at home and spending some scarce time for hobbies most of my potential game time is eaten by translating the game - time, which doesn't gain you experience or gold in game (and even while playing you see a bad translation and go back to correct it). So if at all I get to play a half or one hour per night, which I often spend in a forest to cut some trees up to my max carriage weight to get my scroll vendor stocked. Often there are almost no trees to harvest - in a forest (!), and almost each tree is guarded. My equipment is still my founder equipment. Once I get surrounded by more than one mob, I have to struggle for live, three of them are certain death in a 3 skull area. Most of the guardians do not even give gold, and selling their loot is almost pointless.

I am member of a guild, but for this short time after midnight I get to play I prefer not to bother any of them asking for help.

The gold income during this time is usually far less than 1000 GP. The scroll vendor will generate a few gp as well, but 150 GP per scroll do not bring you far, given the fact, that you have to buy regs again to produce more (the wood is mainly for producing the pulp and the one or other trunk).

What I see often in chat or in forum is the discrepancy in incomes between miners and foresters, hunters, harvesters. Seems to be very single sided, if it comes to return of welfare.

And no, having to grind Oracle or Towncrier runs is also not the way to go in my eyes.

*Salute*
Olahorand

 

there is nothing wrong with the economy, if u wont put the time in to level up, meet new business partners, join the right guild, spend too much time crying on the forums, u wont get anwhere.
its not the economy thats failing

 

I don't think it's as much that people aren't interested is that many just don't know. We have vendors in Wizards Rest and who would even know about them. There is no way to see in game what's going on in the world because we don't have a connected economy. Regional economy would be like splitting the real world up, limiting trade. This is happening in game. We are limiting our imagination and creative sides, putting us all in small boxes of locations. It needs to stop. We need to be connected. Not at you Aklys, I am venting lol

Also in RL a lot of people buy online from wherever they want, so how can that be good except that local stores sell in store and online as well. That's why I vote for in game NPC bulletin boards in town squares to make announcements on, work orders, event announcements, wanted posters, hiring etc. Then announcements can be made all in one place for all to see that click on the bulletin board. Your vendor would be known by the world, well whoever looks at the board that is

oops edited to make more sense. It is late. *cheers*. @DarkStarr @Lord British2.

edited to add photos in this thread too.

 

How long are you going to keep your ridiculous overpriced items then, 2 years? 3 years?

 

Hello Sota o/

I am greatly disheartened by the spirit of these coming changes. After coming to the realization that Sota is TOTALLY against melee builds as a business practice ( I.E creating a kinetic combat experience that appeals more to lowest common denominator like CS:GO players, the type of player that needs to be constantly active or there ADD will kick in) i see were the sentiment for the "balance" changes may be coming from. Honestly, I'm glad this is coming out in the open before i have invested to much time into Sota.

 

The "11% per experiment" refers to the Public Vendor fee (actually 10% + 10g), so I would have to guess... seven days?

 

@DarkStarr Have yall discussed having a more dynamic droprate on resources, rather than a progressive one? Having more accessible, abundant basic resources in lower level areas, and have rarer resource sin difficult areas with less abundance of the basic resources?

An example would be
Tier 1 copper node yields 3 copper per harvest
Tier 3 node yields the rare occasional tungsten or tin and 1-2 copper per harvest
Tier 5 node yields a better chance of tungsten and/or tin, possible 2 units on a node, but only yields 1 copper

^ not exactly this but somethign similar. Of course dotn do this for gold or silver as quantity is their only progression state

Seems like it would help newbies get into a more in-demand market alot sooner (where the wealthy are willing to transfer thier gold to the less established) and has the potential to lower the cost of the most basic goods while keeping more advanced goods at high value.

Due to the crafter experience differences, a higher level crafter that gathers would be more enticed to gather higher end nodes for skill, while buying the now mroe affordable basic materials from lower end gatherers, or enterprizing high end gatherers takign a break from the leveling race to make a profit on in-demand basic materials.

Perhaps even havign high end recipies that require more of the rarer goods than the basic ones as well? Saw yall take that step once with the 2 tin/tungsten & nickle etc per ingot

 

@DarkStarr

The amount of gold does not matter, in a global economic analysis. You should think in terms of purchasing power. Purchasing power depends a lot on competition, but competition can't be there when the market is not "readable".

You should really think about linking the NPC public vendor inventory to all the player's sellers (commission free or not). This would allow everyone to set and to compare prices easily, in each instance. And traders talks when eating with each others, you know

The rewards promised with the Oracle or town criers will benefit only to those who have multiple accounts. They wont bring in new players and most poor outlanders, which have reduced play time, will not even be aware of them.

Redistributing wealth faces two fundamental problems : play time and pledges. Since the last wipe, a month ago, everyone started to 0, except pledge rewards which can be very expensive (because they can be traded). The rest was earned through play time (with more or less optimization). If you really want to avoid this disparity, I think you should think about a way to give more or tax less during the first hours of play time each week. Pretty hard.

One track is : NPC sellers buy anything without quantity limitations. When I'm coming to sell 30 rusty blades, they buy all of them at a decent price, even if someone else sold them 50 rusty blades few seconds before. But do they expect to sell them all one day ? Really ? Those NPC should have some business management and their price should fall when everyone comes to sell them the same thing again, and again, and again... There is one law in economy : even if it's gold, it's worthless if no one buy it except me. In other words, it's worthless if I have a lot in stock.

This way, looting corpses or mining the same thing all the time would be less valuable when pretty unique crafted items would be more. Plus if you link the inventory of each sellers in one instance (keeping the limitation of buying and sellings for their specialization), this systems could be avoided only in exploring new zones.

 

Yet, if they did that it would just have me keep the blades and salvage them into scrap, which can be used to make new goods cheaply. That is the real value if those items.

I just look at it as those items already being at scrap value.

 

The only way you can hava a economy is to remove friend online and single player online. As long as you will have those feature you cannot have a econnomy since you can farme everything alone .

 

So I am seeing a lot of very smart ideas about what Portalarium could try to do to fix the economy in this thread. Really and truly.

But... what are WE going to do to try and improve the economy? Hmm?

I get a sense from some players of a strong Machiavellian attitude wherein it seems like they feel almost "compelled" to do whatever is the most exploit-y, grind-y thing in the game.

It's almost as if some people are saying... well since Port is allowing players to grind it out in the mines in Friends Only mode... then I MUST do that. As if there is some kind of implied "duty" to amass as much in-game wealth as possible in the shortest amount of time possible.

But... to what end?

Nobody sits on their deathbed lamenting that they should have worked harder and accumulated more material goods. Similarly... if this game shuts down, then all your efforts to accumulate that dragon's hoard of gold you've got sitting in your basement that nobody ever sees anyway... will be for absolutely nothing. And even if it doesn't... is it really going to be that fun for you to be a digital millionaire with all "DA BESS GEARZ" before this game even launches?

Sometimes it can be helpful to step back and observe oneself with a questioning mind: What am I doing? Why am I doing this? Is it because I really want to do this, or is it because I have been programmed and conditioned to think and behave a certain way?

It's great for all of us to sit around in the forums suggesting what Port "should" do. (Also keeping in mind whatever they DO do, it will be at least a month for them to collect data and come up with the next set of changes.) But what are WE going to do?

Maybe... stay out of the mines one night and go check out what @Lord Baldrith, @Majoria70, @Audacity, and the other Wizard's Rest residents are doing. Come check out the awesome library in Jaanaford that @Alexander has been building for us. Explore the world, knowing that you might not find anything super cool right away, and that's totally alright. Maybe come up with an idea of your own. Experiment. Have fun.

Play.

Try to let go of the notion that we MUST spend every second in-game being "productive" and accumulating wealth. (Really, haven't we had enough of that IRL?)

Try to let go of the notion that we MUST withhold buying something from another player unless it is hands-down the most definitive "best" price in Novia. ("Gold" is really only electrons. It's not real money. And besides, you have plenty. Right?)

Try to let go of the notion that Portalarium is ultimately responsible for our enjoyment of the game. (We are responsible for our own happiness... here and everywhere.)

 

+1000
I Agree Totally with that.. these feature going to kill that game....
people play in Single or Friendly Online, they do a lot more $$ and Ressources then they play in Full multi..

 

I disagree with that statement. If people have to wait in line just to get the $$ and resources they want, they might not even play the game at all. Ain't nobody got time for that.

I would rather have everyone get on single player or whatever mode they like and start selling me wood and ore for 5-10 GP each.