A plea

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Ulskanine, Nov 22, 2019.

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  1. Duke Ezekiel Cooper

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    Port told the whole community back then that those items in the pledges, telethons, addon store, etc, etc, etc, would be monetarily valuable as time went on in this game.
    Is it not true?

    They laid their whole business model out during development, and then announced that they were going dark after release.
    Is it not true?

    I personally held 5 annual conventions so every question that could be asked, was asked to their face about the economy of this game and how it would evolve. They have done "exactly" what they said they were going to do since 2015.

    You don't have to take a economics lesson from me...
    Your getting schooled just fine without my help.
     
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  2. Vladamir Begemot

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    Well, I haven't made money, and am not really in that space to be even trying.

    You have mountains of stock that has already been payed for and you can still sell, that came out of big bundles at a super discounted rate. That has literally nothing to do with Heritage.

    Heritage seems to have been slapped in to combat that, but doesn't affect the old bundle items, so it makes literally no sense. Literally none.

    You keep telling people to be gold farmers, and talking about flipping of old items. That just makes me think you're in the wrong conversation. Again, all the flippers with any sense sold out long ago, as new items are not ever going to be worth the time. If they have old bundle items, they can still do it, you can still go sell those mountains. And gold farmers can go farm gold. None of this has anything to do with the conversation.

    The only way Heritage even comes close to the above is "We don't want people to buy a new thing, use it for a while, then sell it because they are bored with it or quitting the game."

    And I submit that that right there is causing far more damage in good will and probably sales than it was costing them in the occasional used item sale.

    Edit: Anyway, not getting sucked in further. Heritage and the deco pallet make deco not fun. I'm out.
     
  3. Vladamir Begemot

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    Would have been nice to have known that.
     
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  4. Mishikal

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    I'm not getting schooled in anything. I never played the RMT game, I never spent money on the game to try and sell it later. But I have stopped spending money on the game because of the decisions Port made. And I'm not sure what your "Is it not true?" questions are directed at. Port was the one who said "X item will expire, never to be seen again". Then utterly backtracked on that. That certainly had an effect on RMT people, but again, I'm not one of those. You seem overly obsessed with something that's already been killed off by Port. The point myself and others are making is the way that Port has done this has killed off *other* valid revenue streams *for Port*, reducing their ability to earn income and grow the game.

    As for your stock (I'm assuming you invested in Port), yeah, you have a pile of stock with zero value in a company that now has no assets. Enjoy! :)
     
  5. Duke Ezekiel Cooper

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    Yea I'm invested in Port, and it's still intact, as we were all told at the convention this year...

    But the stock I was referring to was all the pledge, telethon awards, etc, etc, etc.

    I still have all of it...

    Tons of it... And it's all tradable...

    The price keeps climbing with every post that raises hell about it being gone... :)
     
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  6. Mishikal

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    I still have all of mine as well, my wife has all of hers, and we have a bunch of other people's too that we bought when they sold them. But I hate to break it to you, the value of those items (at least in terms of RMT) has decreased over time, not increased. ;)
     
  7. Duke Ezekiel Cooper

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    I bet they don't stay that way...
    Especially since heritage and vault rewards are non-tradable now. ;)
     
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  8. Mishikal

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    I guess time will tell. Current trends don't look promising. ;)
     
  9. Sulaene Moon

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    I would have to agree, now that you can't get items that are tradeable through the crown store any more it should make those items that are still tradeable more valuable. Sort of like a rare item. That's why I don't understand everyone saying that the RMT market is dead. If lots of people like Ezekiel, to use as an example, tried to sell all of their older stuff that is still tradeable he should be able to get a pretty good penny for it. Others said RMT is dead from Release since there are so few players, but it seems there is a bunch of posts and transactions happening over on those forums.

    I DO think that @Duke Ezekiel Cooper @Mishikal @Vladamir Begemot and @HannahAlpenglow2 all have good points. Except you are all arguing amongst each other if only you would see that each of you has very valid points and each is correct in their statements. It just happens that heritage items affect a wide range of different play styles, such as the traders, alt deco placers, to those who tried to hold on to items to cash out later.

    Now if @Duke Ezekiel Cooper is correct and that the company had always planned for items to become non-tradeable at some future date, then they should have stated that long ago so everyone was aware, not just a few who attended a SotACon. That is what I find disturbing, but still within Port's right to do so. they have always complained that communication was never ever their strong point.
     
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  10. Bedawyn

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    Exactly. Which is why it makes no sense at all for Portnip's champions to keep labelling those of us unhappy with Heritage items as pixel-flippers or RMTers. We are two completely different sets of people, perhaps with some small overlap since the criteria for being in each group are irrelevant to each other. But the champions refuse to acknowledge that and just keep labelling us all as RMTers anyway, although it's been obvious since August that wasn't the case.

    And going on about how you still have tons of tradable items? Yeah, you're just pointing out that this is a move that will help a small group of established, well-off players at the expense of everyone else.

    And for reference, no one needs anything in a game. It's ALL want. And the idea that your wants from a game are inherently more important than other people's wants from the same game... yeah. Not making your case there.
     
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  11. Bedawyn

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    Only one character on only one account, yeah. But got to disagree on the "no one playing with them" part. I think they've been pretty darn clear, if only in what they DON'T say and don't do, that solo players are persona non grata now and into the future.

    I loved your description of their attitude towards the decorating market (Sims players), though. I think that's the real problem. Chris is making a monster-killing game. That's the game he wants to make and the player-base he's prioritizing. And it would have only helped the game if they'd had a clearer focus on their target market from the beginning.

    But... monster-killer players want loot. Monster-killers want to earn their goodies by adventuring, not buy them from other players or the crown shop. They may buy patterns for customizing gear once in a while, and not care if those things are account-bound. They may subscribe to support the game, and not care over much about what they get in return. But they're not the ones who are going to spend real cash in the crown shop on a regular basis. They're not the ones who are going to want to keep upgrading and expanding their land holdings. As Elgarion is fond of pointing out, a monster-killer has all the space they'll ever need in a basement on a row lot.

    But the decorators, the Sims players? The ones who DIDN'T start out with a buttload of deco and houses and multiple lots from a backer bundle? We're the ones who want to spend money in the crown shop. We're the ones who want to buy all the surplus goods from the backers with bundles. We're the ones who want to upgrade from the newbie row lot, so we have room to decorate our unique environments. And Catnip knows that, so they're trying to get as much real money out of us as possible by making it much harder for us to buy things for in-game gold. And slapping us in the face in the process, by making it harder for us to USE the items we do buy, and making it clear they consider us just a cash cow and not players whose game needs matter.

    Insulting your customers is NOT the way to get them to keep spending money, much less bring in new players.
     
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  12. Vladamir Begemot

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    Even if we did start out with a buttload of stuff, we wanted to keep going.
     
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  13. Cordelayne

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    Come on man, how many earnings calls have there been where the CEO lied to their shareholders in regards to the companies' fiscal solvency? Remember Enron? Computer Associates? Bear Stearns? This happens ALL the time, unfortunately. I wouldn't just blithely accept their word that everything is ok; especially given the lack of transparency regarding the SeedInvest. Does that mean things are at their most dire? Certainly not, but who really knows? Remember, "Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes"! ;)
     
  14. Cora Cuz'avich

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    Pretty much sums up why I left. I can only move deco items around a lot for so long; I need else somehing to do, and the only things left require either a group, or about 100 million more xp.
     
  15. Bedawyn

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    Yeah, I only meant that newer players without all that stuff provided an obvious market of people to buy it.

    Heck, in my mental SotA, the version of the game I've been designing in my imagination based on "if I'd been the devs (or could buy it out now)", I'm STILL coming up with new ideas for cosmetic items I'd want to give the backers instead of more lots and vendors. Stuff! More stuff! Worlds need stuff! A depth and variety of stuff!

    Just... it's pointless if it's stuff that we can't use with the same depth and versatility. :-(
     
  16. Duke Ezekiel Cooper

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    Bottom line is, the biscuit wheels have fell off the gravy train.

    If you want to deal in the rewards market now,
    you'll have to acquire most of it through subscriptions,
    use the stuff that was given away during development that you saved,
    or wheel and deal to get the tradable stuff from other players.

    The majority of the proceeds from shop sales to old and new players alike now goes to the company and rightfully so...
    This game is persistent now...
    The players that helped it to be "developed" were given a very generous deal for 5 years on some great gear that they could keep or trade.

    We were all warned this time was coming...
    Some listened, some didn't...

    I think this thread and other threads in the forums pretty much divide the two perspective camps.

    I'm off this thread now.

    You guys have a good day,
    Zeke
     
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  17. Mishikal

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    And once again you show your unrelenting focus on RMT, which is not actually what any of this is about. In an aside, Shroud celebrates another month of declining population, setting the lowest all time record since June 2016. So if you think what's happening is working well, I think you're seriously mistaken.
     
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  18. Sulaene Moon

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    How do you know this? I see new people every day.
     
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  19. Mishikal

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    There's a couple of sources. One only tracks people using steam, so it's not representative of the entire population, but it's still a good measure of overall game health:

    https://steamcharts.com/app/326160

    Another source comes from Shroud's own data:

    https://shroudoftheavatar.net/how-many-people-play-shroud-of-the-avatar

    which also shows the continuing overall user population decline

    And there's another set of data that again anyone can gather from Shroud itself, that is only tracking people actively adventuring, but again, shows similar drops:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/shroudoftheavatar_raw/comments/e4m7mz/leaderboard_numbers/
     
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  20. Vladamir Begemot

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    Well, at least now we know why they don't mind destroying all these systems. Apparently at the convention the people who collaborate on all this believe everyone should pick up an ax and pick and go sell gold for money, and as long as that's happening, all of us non attending, out of the loop sorts will be happy.

    Hopefully the collaborators will keep the boat afloat long enough to rebuild the deco system. Unless it's just out in favor of combat, who knows what they have decided there?
     
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