Leveling Progression for Crafting needs fixing

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Elrond, Dec 9, 2019.

  1. Elrond

    Elrond Avatar

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    I went to the test server today to see what level i need for my next 0.1 stat boost ..i currently have 149 in plate masterwork with 130 mil craft xp used . I can add 1.7 avoid /1.7 str stat at lvl 149 ... went as high as lvl 164 and the stats i can add are the same 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ...lvl 164 needs 540 mil craft xp .

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    So if i drop 410 mil more craft xp into my masterwork skill what do i get ? NOTHING .

    Lvl - 146 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots) - 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 152 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots - 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 155 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots- 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 157 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots - 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 158 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots - 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 159 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots- 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 160 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots- 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 161 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots- 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 162 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots - 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 163 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots- 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )
    Lvl - 164 - 1.7 avoid /1.7 str ( gauntlet, boots - 3.4 avoid /3.4 str ( legs , chest )

    @Chris ..is this ever gonna get fixed ??
     
  2. oplek

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    Looks like the soft caps are working as intended.
     
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  3. Charon

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    Wow ...

    I guess I'm glad I stopped at 107?
     
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  4. Elrond

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    I think placing a 500 mil XP wall to get 0.1 to something and calling it soft cap is overreaching . I know so many players that quit because of how crafting leveling progression was managed . Some tried to discuss this issue with port and hit the same wall ... eventually they quit the game ( some of these people were governors sold their towns and everything else they had because of this ). As more and more players level their crafting skills they will eventually hit the same wall and theyre not gonna be happy . Ignoring this issue or pretending is something acceptable will not improve this situation .

    With that said my hope is with the recent change in leadership , Chris is finally gonna do something about this . A decent leveling progresion for crafting will mean a huge boost for the economy overall... espcially farmers ..but pretty much every raw material that can be turned into craft xp will be very high valued . That means more gold for new players and old players ... alot of crafters will level their skills and pay gatherers or farmers for resource need it to lvl .
     
  5. Barugon

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    @Elrond
    Do you have enchant/masterwork level progression benefits from 100?
     
  6. Elrond

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    No ..maybe next test server... i had to unlearn all my enchant skills to see how high id need plate armor masterwork for next 0.1 .
     
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  7. Restless

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    This seems about right. There needs to be a cap on gear. I'd actually prefer to see the same cap with the exp req curve more linear, such that lvl 160 would end with the stats you can currently make and the .1 would add every 10 levels after 100 or thereabouts.
     
  8. oplek

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    I think a hard cap may actually be an improvement. At least it psychologically is easier to step off the treadmill and move onto other things.

    If infinite progression is possible, then I tend to think that it should translate into tiered equipment. For example, if you're producing in the 120-130 bracket, then only AL 120-129 can use it. And maybe one tier less, with penalty. That way new players aren't hopelessly behind the curve... and high-tier players can essentially have their own economy apart from low-tier players, and compete with each other instead.

    I dunno, thinking out loud.
     
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  9. Elrond

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    Actually game was sold as no cap on skills or gear ( combat or craft skills) ...but crafting is taking alot of punishment ...

    - Lvl a combat skill from 145 to 165 ( 500 mil xp ) and you will see real leveling progression .
    - Lvl a craft skill from 145 to 165 ( 500 mil xp) and you will see 0 leveling progresion .

    - Add specialisations to combat skills - that further enchance skills for combat .
    - Promise to add specialisations for crafting and instead add a reroll that does nothing for the craft skills .

    - 254 active combat skills + 29 combo skills vs 74 passive crafting skills ( Crafting doesnt have 1 single interactive skill)

    As a crafter the measure of control for what you make is extremely limited ..the way you interact with the product you make is completely random skill only determines if you are succesfull in placing a , b or c and the str of the effect.

    I know we can have a better, more complex crafting system....fixing leveling progression for crafting can be a good start .
     
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  10. Mishikal

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    I think it would be very helpful to know the level at which further XP spending is pointless in a given crafting skill. ;) Glad you're starting to do the legwork @Elrond

    Historically, Chris has avoided crafting like the plague, but clearly some sort of resolution to this is needed, whether it's to just say ok there's a hard cap, or to figure out a way to make progression meaningful. I thought there was in fact a hard cap of level 200 on all skills (combat and crafting), leaving aside the question of whether it serves any point to get to 200 currently.
     
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  11. Elrond

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    He is in charge now .

    It takes years of gathering and crafting to get 400-500 mil craft xp and when you finally have it you realise all your work and focus has literally been for nothing a big fat 0 gain. Gives a whole new meaning to the phrase '' works as intended '' .
     
  12. oplek

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    The Kickstarter says,

    ... and we all now how well the "classless skill system" turned out. But nothing about "no cap". What was sold throughout its development was a soft-cap system, which you're currently experiencing. So again, working as intended. They were never intending on people ever reaching level 200.

    There has to be a limit, hard or soft, otherwise people will quit for other reasons, such as never being able to catch up or compete. If the game is quittable because a skill cap was met, the problem wasn't skill caps. The problem is that only the treadmill exists. I'm waiting for something beyond making my numbers go up.
     
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  13. Barugon

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    I had a glowing belt buckle and a strip of troll skin and then I finally looted a troll belt recipe. I crafted the belt and got lucky with an exceptional, which gave me, I believe, ~1.3 million producer experience. I was jumping for joy.

    Yeah, 400-500 million producer experience would require a certain level of... dedication.

    ...I almost said insanity.
     
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  14. Elrond

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    The limit is already there its lvl 200 ....not 147 . Im not worried about people who login once a month and are upset they cant catch up...im not worried about new players not being able to craft stuff as good as crafters playing for years ...what im interested in is players who spend years to lvl their skills should get something for their effort right now they get nothing ...and youre saying its ok to level a skill for 3 years and get nothing ...so lets analyse .. what would be worse

    - investing 2-3 years to get 500 mil xp , tens of mil of gold/thousands of dollars in cash just to get NOTHING ,and most important resource countless HOURS or
    - joining a new game and complaining that someone playing for years can craft better stuff then you by 0.1 -1 stat? or
    - i cant catch up with high level crafters because i dont wanna invest in my craft skills because i just wanna sell all my gold...
     
  15. Girlsname

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    Just think about how many hours that was spent refining.

    Lol too many yikes for me.

    (But I love my big boy crafters <3)
     
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  16. Garfunkel Humperdinck

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    There should be something happening when you level that high even if it's a tiny gain.

    Has there ever been any talk of adding specialization to the crafting trees that give specific bonuses to the field you choose to pick similar to what exist on the adventuring side?

    That seems like a way to add depth to the system, as well as diversify who can create what. It could also give us another place to pour in our crafting experience that feels meaningful.
     
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  17. Elrond

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    There was alot of talk...they agreed to give us crafting spec....and then they said spec for crafting is being replaced with rerolls ... a good good way to give something meaningless to crafters .

    Can read more about that discussion here -
    Crafting Specialisation - Just Rerolls ?
     
  18. dayero

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    I dare say this is unfixable. Either you have some sort of cap or you have an economy were just the very best crafter churns out all of the top level gear in the game and every other crafter is basically fucked.
    Frankly a hard cap would be more transparent for players. Spreading out negligible gains over thousands of hours of grind doesnt make any sense. And as soon as you increase those negligible gains to meaningful gains, you break the economy again. So just cap it and be done with it.
     
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  19. Elrond

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    I agree.

    The thing is right now players are told crafting has 200 levels...invest...buy, spend, invest in your skills..the higher the skill the better ... when really its not. Placing a hard cap would kill the farmers especially and most reagents . Crafting is the biggest gold sink in the game..you kill leveling you cripple the economy.... as bad as leveling progression is now.... the further you go the worse it gets ...so we must have a bubble where people think if they spend something they get something when it comes to crafting...that bubble breaks once you hit 145 ....and you realise youre not getting anything anymore or very little.

    As for a crafter churning out all the top gear..i disagree..theres too many skills for 1 or a few crafters to be the best in all of them. I am very active as a crafter so lots of people know who i am...but i know people who are banking 200-300 mil more craft xp then me ...theres alot of high lvl crafters out there..but theyre only interested in making stuff for themselves .

    Competition is good for any economy ... alot more people would invest in their craft skills...if they actually meant something.... as it stands now only few people bother going beyond 140 .
     
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  20. Illiaro

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    The game was sold as having a soft cap. If people can apply unlimited amounts of XP to gain higher and higher skill levels, there won't be a place in the game for new crafters. New crafters have been punished enough as it is.
     
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