Outdoor Storage (Lawns)

Well, stealing isn't in the game, so I can't really speak to that, you can't take a freedom away that doesn't exist. That's like saying the game has taken away the freedom of riding around in flying cars and chatting on their cellphones. Unlike viewable, non-instanced player housing, stealing is not in the game. So I'll use a mechanic already in game. PvP
PvP is designed in a way to give PvPers freedom to play how they want, but with restrictions. They can't kill any player at random (except in designated areas), but they can still battle with others who enjoy that play-style where ever they want. I.E. PvP battles in town. Now suppose someone takes offense to them having battles in town. They think it is unrealistic to see showdowns in the city street while NPCs stand idly by, hawking their vegetables and fish steaks, and takes away from their gameplay. Do you further restrict those people, saying now they have to go to a special instance to have their battles because someone doesn't like violence in the city streets? No, it would restrict someone's gameplay for someone else's aethetics. Unless all housing was made instanced (which very few people would want to happen), restricting how people can decorate (which is already restricted by the items the game deems as decorations, item counts, light limits, etc) is the same as resigning PvPers to only duel inside a box away from other players.

 

Well if we're only talking about what's currently in the game...then once the true death penalty is in place we're going to have a lot less freedom. The same can be said of many other mechanics. The game is not complete. Stealing is not in the game for Episode I, but it's been said that it will be included for future Episodes (probably II).

But if we look at PVP, what you're saying is essentially true (I agree) that the comparison is between "gameplay" and "ascetics". However, for players that don't pvp, the ascetics ARE the gameplay. So we get into a logic loop that doesn't quite make sense here. It's all gameplay, depending on what's important to you.

At the end of the day we have to draw a line somewhere. The game has to have either hard rules, or soft rules that are encouraged to be followed. Housing is not going to be instanced (thankfully), but that doesn't mean housing can't be influenced by environmental effects like weather. Does this infringe on the freedoms of the game as we currently understand it today? No, it enhances the gaming environment.

 

Taking the opinion of what looks good and what doesn't out of the question since it is so subjective and since the mix of magic and tech can blur some lines, how is it decided what will degrade over time when the weather effects get put in?

I have a bird bath with my pledge level. I would think it would be made to be outside. Construction technology used to make that bird bath would be the same available as those to make crafting stations. If the crafting station degrades, will my bird bath also degrade? What if I put a tent over the crafting station in the front of my yard. Does that protect it? Will it still degrade over time? Will the tent degrade? Will anything outside of the actual house degrade? If I purchase a statue with the plans of putting it outside in my garden, am I going to be taxed so it doesn't degrade in the weather? Will it be flagged as an "outside" item and not degrade?

I guess if we have a flag on every item as an "inside" item or an "outside" item based on the intent of the actual construction by the dev team and if someone decides to put the painting that would normally go inside the house outside on their fence and it degrades over time due to the weather, that would work for me. It would give the freedom of everyone to decorate how they wanted with restrictions on what would normally go outside.

I still would prefer no leaderboard on decorations and no restrictions on where things are placed but if they want to encourage crafting with the destruction of some items over time, I could live with something like this. It seems like a lot of work and yet another indicator that has to be set and maintained for something that really doesn't have a true affect on the game other than the aesthetics.

 

Eh, no thanks.

Pick your nose, pick your neighbors, but don't pick your neighbors nose.

This has been beaten to death over the course of 6 pages. Don't allow the mob's subjective opinion affect my environment. What would come next, a weather leader board?

Make it rain!

 

Our gaming environment. Not yours.

 

Thinking of you.

Courtesy of the BMC in Merriston:

 

Stealing isn't allowed because people don't want things taken they worked hard to acquire.

It's the same reason why players don't want restrictions on items placed in their yard they worked hard to purchase or craft. They want to show them off, regardless of how you feel about their decorating tastes.

You know, every time I get close to pledging I read a post like yours and an invisible force pushes my hand away from my credit card. Thanks for saving me money Baron, but I don't think that's what Portalarium wants me to do.

 

Who wants to be Novia's first Lawn Czar? The War On Lawns must be vigilant and remove these junkyards from the community! Today, it's messy lawns. Tomorrow, it will be vagrants, thievery, prostitution, drugs, and disco music. Who knows what horrible future we'll have if we don't remove these unkempt tasteless anarchists from these lands!

To set an example, I've very neatly moved all my lawn decorations inside:


In all seriousness...

This is just unfounded fear. The value of your home is going to be largely dictated by its proximity to high value resources and unique NPC services. The impact that an unkempt neighbor has on your property value is going to be nil. Nobody is going to care as long as they have quick access to the other factors.

Oh please. The original intent in the OP was your personal objection to unkempt lawn decorations. The weathering angle was just a way to enforce that. While I agree with weathering, I disagree with limiting expression based on personal bias. If you had omitted your personal agenda and simply kept it to weathering, this would have been a non-issue. But I would still stand by my weathering suggestions that it affect all game systems and items, not just exterior decorations.

Now this is a conversation worth having. There was a post earlier about the functional value of lawns. As of now, there isn't much to it except for placing purely decorative objects. We're still waiting for more functional items such as farmable plots or other items that actually makes functional use of lawns. That would encourage more people to use their lawn property in other ways. But make no mistake, it should never be enforced.

 

Last I checked I paid My money to play this game. Which means that I get to play the game my way and Drake gets to play the game the way he wants. If you don't like it.. Then don't look at my yard and don't rp with me. Honestly I promise just for you there will be a junk yard in as many places as I can put one just because I absolutely hate when other "Players" Try and dictate how the game should and shouldn't be played, by other players.
Have a nice day

 

Haha smack, I always admire your mind. Thanks for the pic. I do know that Baron Drocis fights for the good of the game and he knows we don't always agree. Worrying about others property when this was said to be a game with some of the UO features of placing items on the ground everywhere, this is a part of that promise. I'm not sure that is going to happen, but it did in UO and we liked it. If someone standing next to you had made hundreds of chests and set them all around the bank grounds, that was just the game, not a horrible infraction of human nature, lol no one said that just me. Others could pick them up, it was free stuff. I am not saying we have to be UO but limits have to be more lax in this game. People are coming here for an RG game, we can't go so crazy on the rules except where they make sense and have to be done. We do not need to invent a bunch of extra restrictions that ruin the sandbox feel, that needs to be preserved. So the implications of taking away freedoms bit by bit will of course make this game like any other game out there with little freedom . This is not just one persons opinion, and if the development team takes one persons thoughts on this then that is not ok. Everyone matters.

 

That's actually really creative. I like that. Of course I'd like it a lot more if over time those items were degrade due to the weather.

 

lol it is very artistic isnt it Looks like a lot of work.

 

You miss the point. Some people feel as strongly about the freedom to steal as others feel about the freedom to decorate.

You're defending one freedom while dismissing another.

 

How would weather impact items inside someone's home? Are you saying that weather would impact anything outside of a home? Sure, that makes sense to me. But are you saying weather should impact a table in your backpack? I don't think I'd agree with that. I think to simulate a reasonable sense of immerssion it should only impact the stuff you place outside on the ground.

 

Are you really trying to compare the freedom of decorating a lot that you purchased and maintain with the freedom to steal as you see fit from other characters?

I personally see no comparison in any way. How you decorate your lot or dress your character (or don't dress them) has no real affect on how I can play the game or IF I can play the game. If I don't like how you decorate, I will avoid your place if I hate it that much or I will ignore it as I run by but I can still run by it. If I don't like how you dress, I will avoid your characters (not really, I don't care how you dress) or again, ignore it completely. It doesn't affect me in how I play and I shouldn't be able to tell you what to wear or not to dance here or how to decorate your lot.

Now, when you come over and steal my stuff or player kill my character just because you want to, that is having a direct affect on my game, not just what I see. I can't just "not notice or ignore" that and have it not affect me.

Not sure how comparing stealing and decorating even fit in this thread at all. Freedom for decorating doesn't mean you should have freedom to do anything. Apples and oranges in my opinion.

 

Actually decorations have a huge impact on other players...else what's the point? We could just make this a single player game and it would probably save us quite a bit of time, money, and resources.

Don't let your style of play color your vision so that other people can't be happy. I think stealing should be in the game (with restrictions). I think decorating should be in the game (with restrictions). There's really no difference at all.

 

We will just have to disagree on this then.

 

Ah realism, immersion. The environment, atmospheric conditions affecting the game. Good.

So ...... you would favor dust gathering inside a home? Rain making roads impassible? Volcanic ash choking all of us to death due to atmospheric proximity? Skin cancer? A tornado permanently wrecking your home? A hurricane wiping out entire towns, forever? Allergies? Barnacles and rust on boats? Degradation of rope and clothing? Vendors having their wares spoiled by water damage, heat and humidity?

No, I think what your really want is a disincentive to put stuff in our yards. Just admit it.

Oh. And how did you get an entire table into your backpack? That doesn't seem realistic.

 

This is from the OP...

I think it's clear that I want to discourage people from putting non-traditional junk in their yards just because it's convenient. I'm not alone in this. The devs have obviously taken notice too. Not because I wrote this thread, but likely because they have eyes.

 

It depends on how complicated they want to make the sim. I think initially anything outside is a good start, perhaps above ground first since we can treat underground as an interior space (day/night cycles of light affecting game systems aside). And yeah, stuff inside containers wouldn't apply, as far as weathering is concerned. We already know there will be item decay for food regardless of how / where its stored but that's another system. Although I can see how weather can affect that system but again that would make the sim that much more complex.