Overland Map Changes

There are few ideas in this thread to make it more interesting such as fog of war(not the best term to use). No reason they can't do all of those things you meantioned with the current map system.

Think visibility of the mapis restricted at night and in deep forrests. Dungeons and interesting areas not on map until you find them or know about them.

I am totally against the baldurs gate style click on locations since it won't work for this game at all.

 

It was never ever going to be atrue 3d world you walked around in...you know this. It was going to be a map with 3d icons.

Why do you keepmaking it sound like it was going to be that way?

 

Because it looked like it. Look at the animated gif below. This was how the overland map looked before R4. You walked around freely on the overland map and thus it felt like you wandering around in the world. Sure, you still entered "hexes" but walking around in the overland view felt like roaming around in the world. The animals and the animations and the realisitic look added to this feeling.

 

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There is no reason they couldn't add dragons and such to the current map as well...I was just loking at a pic of it and thinking how cool it actually would look if drawn correctly.

 

Then of course I will change it

A paper dragon? Or would it be some symbol like the flag? How would it look like if there would be a "real" Dragon flying around when everything else would be made of paper or be a symbol?

Even the movement was different on the RTX overworld map as you walked around freely on it. It just looked so much better, more immersive, more atmospheric, more like a world.

The map looks good for a map but not for an overworld view that could be so much more than a map if it was done like in the RTX demo.

 

So...lets lay it down in black and white here: its the same concept as in R4, just with more stuff drawn in.

Nope, still cant get behind it. Not even a bit. If you can, good for you (no need to berate me).

I have to again go back to my assessment that a MAP and an OVERLAND VIEW are two completely different things. Interestingly, right now we have neither in that, to my knowledge, we arnt actually getting an in-game map while what Portalarium did in R4, and are apparently not wavering on, is they have made the overland view look like a map, and in the process undermined the overland view's form and function completely. And yes the game NEEDS an overland view to mask the fact that there is no cohesive world (just a bunch of disparate hexes). The....whatever they want to call it....actually drives home the fact that the world is nothing more than a bunch of fragments.

What is an Overland View then? Darkmoon has given us far too many examples to start reiterating them here, but the core principal is that an overland view is an abstraction of the contents of the underlying cells which is still "playable" on an abstracted layer......curiously enough, pretty much what RG showed over and over again pre R4.

 

I can only agree.

So here is to our liege, Lord British, using words of the great Cimmerian Conan the Barbarian:

"Lord British, I have never prayed to you before. I have no tongue for it. No one, not even you, will remember if we were good men or bad. Why we fought, or why we died. All that matters is that we need a living, lush, "realistic" looking 3D overland view in Shroud of the Avatar. That's what's important! Valor pleases you, Lord British... so grant me one request. Grant me the lush 3D "realistic" overland view! And if you do not listen, then to Electronic Arts with you!"

 

Well I still prefer the original 3d map we were shown but I found myself not hating the map as much as I did R4. It did improve a fair amount and with some of the changes people have been suggesting here it could become pretty good. Still though I think you could do most/all of those ideas with the original map idea with better results imo.

 

Release 5 was a step into the right direction. Hopefully it will be further expanded (many great suggestions in this thread: random encounters; province borders; more options while traveling (like ambushing other players in PvP, etc.); there could be easily some kind of Statistics Menu on the cloth maps and an Overview over your Quests, Home, Guild, the political situation on the continent, etc.).

 

If other players besides your party members are shown on the map there would be many flags moving around. Maybe too many. I don't know if this would look so good. If they would then include animals roaming around on the map and maybe gypsy wagons and merchants - maybe all represented by flags or some symbols, too - this could end in a flag/symbol chaos.

This would not be so bad with the realistic 3D overland map as there everything is looking more organic, more natural, just like in a real world or other games using 3D overland worlds.

 

I'm thinking maybe some 'fog of war', a larger area to explore, items not necessarily showing on the map until the actual play area is explored and the dungeon/special location is found and some graphical enhancements and we may be good to go.

Part of the problem for me is the second I go into the map I automatically see everything and know where all the interesting locations and towns are. I'd rather explore the world and find them on my own. Once I've found them they could become part of my map.

Otherwise I do not have an issue with the direction they are taking.

 

I think before this map we didnt have a problem. I dont know how they are going to improve the map to make it acceptable to the people that doent like it. Should they add color? Or a 3d view.

 

Back to the 3D view of course

 

How are you guys getting in the R5 release?
The client won't let me in :-(

 

I can see where the map is used as a placeholder, or excuse for the delay caused when you leave one hex and enter another. People can accept having their walk down the path fade out and transition to a map I guess. For me it is not the map that is the irritant, it is the horrible transition to a new hex. If the map did not exist at all, when you walk down a path and cross the hex line, your computer would glitch as the new data is exchanged, and suddenly there could be mobs around you or other environmental differences in the single step across the barrier. For me, I would like it if the map was available, but opened only when I choose it for long distance travel. Otherwise, I will swallow hard and accept the jerky straight line travel as I plow through the hex boundaries.

 

DNA, There was a dev+ test yesterday for a couple of hours. Servers are currently down until the R5 release starts in a few hours.

 

thanks very much

 

But unfortuntely as the hexes/scenes repeat themselves (as there are only a handful different ones) you would then walk through the exact same areas over and over again. Therefore travel across an overland world/map is neccessary. But this travel should be as immersive and atmospheric as possible which this map we now have cannot deliver, imo.

 

I agree. This would mean though that the paths in and out along every hex would need to line up with the next or else you might appear inside a rock, behind a treeline, etc.. Not impossible but definitely more work for the Devs at this time.
A possible way to do this would be to make hexagonal play areas with pre-determined entrance/exit points along that edge marked by a number/symbol to indicate entry/exit points. Then when they want to develop these areas they just need to line up the sides using the number/symbol that represents where they enter/exit. Something like this:


Then they could have play areas mesh as you travel from one play area to the next without having to jump into the map. Anything in the middle of the hexes wouldn't matter.

Also they could make the areas smaller so that there would be less data to load and the 'jerkiness' wouldn't be as apparent. This would mean more hexes on the overland map to explore but I think I could live with that. ;-) .

Still, we have what we have and I doubt they will go back to scratch to implement these type of changes. Like I said before, this new map we have could work as well but I don't want everything automatically handed to me. I'd like to explore to show the map and then have items appear on it as I discover them.