Quick FAQ on the new targeting stuff.

No tab target? Really? I just killed a watcher while directly facing a wolf. Not happy with the inability to target what I want reliably at all.

Definitely not liking this change.

No target selection is a major deal-breaker. Use alt+space, alt+x, esc, anything other than tab for changing modes and get target selection back in. Star Wars Galaxies had this down pat in 2003 - how is it this is being reinvented horribly in a game in 2016?

Unbelievable and unnecessary changes in the 22nd hour.

 

Question: what is causing the following behavior?

Mage build, using cursor mode with fixed deck (clicking on glyphs to fire them off). One handed sword and shield.

I target and hit a distant wolf with fire arrow and searing ray and then he is upon me. I keep facing this wolf, hitting it with flame fist and my sword (auto attack) between spells.

Fire arrow has cooled down so I fire it at the wolf again. I see the fire animation shoot off to the side where it hits a different distant wolf who comes running. I didn't know that 2nd wolf was there and wasn't facing it.

What happened here? Was it because I hadn't aimed the reticle downwards to keep hovering over the wolf at my feet?

 

I'd appreciate knowing what real-world physics have to do with magic attacks? I'm also quite unclear on how rangers hit far off targets by firing straight-ahead. That's not real - you have to use an arc to hit targets that are at a distance. When is that going to be put into the game? There is no reason that I cannot RP sending a fireball up over enemies to hit enemies at a distance or have it spawn right next to the enemy and hit it.

Why throw out what was working for the last year+ siting awful "realism" ideals. There is no immersion gained for me with this change. In real life I can hit what I aim at and definitely what I swing at. In real life I have much more to go on that a flat limited view. I have spatial sound, touch, smell, and the ability to swing at what I want, not what is directly in front of me.

 

Quite likely a good deal. No matter the source, the manifestation of power would likely be ruled by some set of pseudo-physics if not the regular ones. Lightning, ice, fire, projectiles - all have some real-world proxy. You could even argue that things like death rays might take the form of vibrations similar to sound waves.

To go to your other point.... no the current system itself isn't that close to physics itself.

 

It's extremely forgiving right now but basically, yes.

The technical side, as I can see it, is that there are four major things to keep in mind.

1. The camera isn't the Avatar's eyes
2. There is a 90 degree target cone that emits from the camera
3. The closest thing in that target cone is hit with the spell you're casting
4. Sometimes you will hit things that you're not looking at due to #3, so look for the reticle changes and color changes to refine targeting.

As to feedback, I'd appreciate either supporting my request for more specific target selection capacity or maybe something else that you think is better. I like this style of combat but I do not like the lack of control to select my target. My feedback thread is here.

 

I think the new system would be even better if the targeting would really work like in a shooter. You aim and shoot with the crosshair. The arrow hits what is in the way. So we would have to aim very clearly.
With melee we hit what is in the way of our blade.
This would remove the confusion that comes up when we aim at an enemy but hit another one.

 

Not sure when real-life smell emulation is going to be implemented in Shroud, but probably not for Release 1.

 

Theirs things about this new system that are nice.. like not having to target, but that's not a good thing. Its not that you don't have to target anymore.. its you CAN'T target anymore. I want to like it.. I don't. Its going backwards. Control are getting worse and worse, not better and I don't understand why. Best pvp shroud has had was before all the fixes. 1st step in the wrong direction was when they turned turning off with melee attacks.. so people stopped using melee attacks and went all range. Simple answer would be to listen to all the people saying we need autoface on melee glyphs... but they went the other way and made range unusable because no target lock.
I am disappointed. This feels completly retarded and is taking the game in the wrong direction. At one time I felt in control.. now I feel like I'm driving a car with two flats.

 

Irony is.. all the full time pvp guys agree on what needs to be done for pvp and their never listened to. Guys who don't pvp full time are leading the changes.

 

Do we want a game where the challenge is all about overcoming bad controls? Is that what everyone wants? Because that's exactly where their taking us.

 

I highly advise going back to targeting, and using auto turn on melee glyphs. It was the best setup Shroud has had, and had the most people pvping of all releases. Every since going away from this pvp has been going down in flames.

 

Frankly I'm totally baffled about one thing that folks keep repeating, namely "you hit the thing closest to you". It simply isn't true. But the claim resurfaces again and again, like a zombie that rises back from death, no matter how many times you try to kill it.

Can't comment about PvP, but range has never been easier, and has never had better usability than now, precisely because of no target lock.

That said, I've tried doing combat with "cursor mode" and it makes targeting both unreliable and confusing. I believe it is the biggest source of complaints at the moment, because it's not really the "compromise" it was apparently intended to be, instead it basically takes the worst aspects from both worlds.

 

I find it odd anyone would say range is easier. I shoot the ground because I'm not quite close enough.. I shoot the guy behind my target a lot.. I find I lure more enemies in by using range even if I'm just trying to attack guy infront of me. If theirs a pack of say 5 creatures their near immortal versus range because they keep changing up position and the wounded heal up.

 

We just needed auto turn when using close range glyph and maybe a target lock button for certain occasions. ( Primarily duels )

 

What i was hearing is you hit the closest target within a 90% cone in front of the camera (not in front of your character)

 

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f.../new-targeting-combat-movement-systems.50008/

 

This happened to me, I had a spider in target but my spells barely damaged it, I panned around with the viewer and found another spider at my feet which at the time I did not even see, I had to look straight down... this was the one damage was being done to.

 

@Chris In your OP here, you showed a video of how easy it is to choose ranged targets with a bow in this new system.

Those targets were stationary though and didn't even attack back... that makes a big difference compared to what we are experiencing!

Can you please do a similar video demonstration where you have say a set of Archer, Mage, and Melee enemies. And then have them follow their typical AI (archer and mage move in different directions and start firing back at you while the melee runs up and starts wailing on you in the face)? Then demonstrate how we're supposed to easily aim that crosshair at the ranged mobs while the melee is taking the damage instead. Oh, and please do this by using some of your hotbar skills (including some stacks or combos) and not just auto attack.

While you are at it, I would love to see a separate video of you at your computer during this demonstration to show your mad skillz! It should show your screen and your keyboard/mouse interaction and how you are able to line up your targets with a reticle and still be able to use your hotbar skills while you and the mobs are on the run.

I'm trying to get used to this "targetless" system but I'm finding it hard to use my hotbar stacks and combos properly when I have to keep my eyes focusing back and forth between the screen for the crosshair and my keyboard for the hotbar activation.

I've already committed to full-time cursor mode as that is the only way I'm able to stack/combo spells and still semi-focus on the crosshair.

 

If you have a target selected (indicated by red outline) it will stay that way until you select another target (either intentionally or by accident).

If you have guy A as target who is 20 yards away, and guy B is 5 yards away, you will still attack A. You can also easily alternate between A and B if you wish. The same distance difference applies regardless of whether you use the camera or the player as the reference point. Distance by itself does not matter, as long as a) all enemies in question are within your attack range and b) you have not selected another target.

Now selecting another target can happen quite easily by accident, especially in cursor mode. Targets closer to the reticule get selected more easily. This still does not mean that target distance would play any direct role.

So you had the red outline on the spider you could see, but the attacks still went somewhere else? This sounds very much like a bug and not the intended result. Have you reported it? Also on the other hand, the reticule placement definitely needs some tuning, especially when there are enemies at very close (melee) range. Sometimes the sloppy targeting seems to lead to unexpected results - I too have difficulties keeping target on an enemy right in my face, but as an archer I rarely encounter such a situation.

 

We went from loosing target on occasion to not being able to target at all Minor changes could have been done to old targeting system that would have fixed the problems and left us with far better controls. Mainly tab targeting red enemies as primary targets, enemies who had not been engaged should get less tab priority... when no red enemies are in view, tab targeting should cycle from yellows first. One button to lock target would have helped to. To give balance melee needed auto turn when using glyph, and aoe's needed slightly greater area. That would have been best possible of all things I have seen so far. This new system is a step back at the wrong time.