The net effect of card combat on me and how YOU THE PLAYER can start a REVOLUTION

I think the ideal combat system that you are looking for is the one used in Bleach Online... because it doesn't care about network lag...

 

I think less is more but I like the random system to a point, I think a mix of three fixed and three random seems to be the best. when I had 8-9 card deck I seemed to get a lot of the same cards, but just three random selections for buffs and my main two attacks plus a heal on fixed seemed to me the best option as fights did not last that long.

 

I'm going to pause right here. Do you mean WASD movement coupled with the mouse? Because that's how a vast majority of 3D games on PC deal with character movement. I'm confused, do you want click-to-move; a-la Diablo or Lineage?

Believe me, there are some rough times when trying to keep an enemy targeted, and maneuver around the environment dodging shrubbery and trying to hit ALT+9 to heal myself (because that's where the heal spell decided to show up). I'm usually using Left+Right click to move. Maybe that would help you out?

I just gotta point out that the beloved Ultima 7 featured real-time combat. I never thought SotA was going to be turn-based. Was there something that gave you that impression?

I'm curious what MMOs you've played which did not have this control scheme.

macroing != botting

Like a knocked arrow, Dallas looses hope from his bow, striking you firmly in the heart.

There's a reason why Hearthstone has a timer in head-to-head competition. So people aren't sitting there waiting for the other player to take their turn. Now, imagine if you've got 5 people fighting against each other; how does a new combatant enter the fray? How do you resolve whose turn it is?

You want... what? An isometric game? A camera on rails? Hearthstone?

It seems like you had some fundamental misconceptions on how the game would play. I'm not sure how that happened.

 

I thank that having both deck and locked address both sides, the deck builders get the randomness ...or fun!
And the lock skills get there access to the skill's they like ie fun for them!

My only consuren is the balance of 50% more for using the lock, witch im sure will be addressed !


Grate job devs, and see you all in the game!

 

I'm sure they're working on those deep story aspects in parallel. Right now they have to get a lot of the mechanics hammered down.

I personally can't wait to see some of the new towns that Stephen Daniele has been concept arting (can I use that as a verb?)

 

I hate to judge the system too harshly yet. The game it just too early and unplayably clunky at this point. It's too early. The game just has a long, long way to go to a point where anything would be immersive or "fun".

I applaud the fact that they're trying to corral 20+ skills into 4-5 or so keys. This is the same things I would try to do as well, and I agree completely with this goal.

Any game would be jarring to get dropped in as a new player and hit with and end game set of skills. As a new player, I'd rather see it with one skill, then two, etc. As it is now, you have to understand a dozen skills or get confronted with a deck full of slugs...which is not a normal experience learning any game.

As I've said before, I'd rather see the skills laid out left to right from 1=most defensive, to most offensive. And I don't like the slug mechanic as all.

 

I'm enjoying the combat so far. Much more interesting than most multi-player RPG games I've played recently. Once it is fully fleshed out it will be even better! Much potential, and already fun. Well done!.

 

Agreed. I actually love it. It's a completely different look at combat and pvp, and i for one was so tired of the staleness that is mmo combat. I really hope they keep it, if anything at all just some tweeks.

 

I switched to mouse movement only, keeping both mouse buttons pressed, to free up my left hand for the other keyboard keys. This has been an improvement, except that occasionally the camera somehow gets sticky (camera still moves with the mouse even after releasing the mouse buttons). Doing this for normal game play gets tiring (constantly keeping both mouse buttons pressed) but for PvP it seems ok. I still prefer a well done auto-camera mode like what is used in most 3D MMORPGs. But at least with this setup (ditching the WASD in favor of mouse only for movement+camera) I was able to move fluently and pvp competitively.

I also made 3 cards sticky and put 5 copies each of some important skills in the deck. With more sticky cards the focus penalty becomes too bad, even with focus skills trained up. It is still rather weird though and this way I end up using a lot less different skills than in other MMORPGs I played.

To clear up some misunderstandings above: I don't expect turn based combat or a top down isometric camera like in Ultima 7 or Baldur's Gate. Of course this is a full 3D MMORPG and will have to work differently. The point I tried to make is that the old turn based system favored thinking, planning and tactics over action and reaction, which contributed to the appeal of the classic Ultimas and, conversely, Ultima 9 lacking in that respect contributed to the comparatively weak appeal of that last game in the series. The question to ask here is: How can non turn based combat in 3D be made more tactical and less a matter of fast reactions? I think the faster things happen and the more random elements are introduced, the more it becomes a matter of quick reaction and less a matter of deeper tactical thinking and planning.

By the way, the matter raised here is unrelated to the actual skills and powers being added to the game. I found a lot of interesting stuff in those skill trees. I am just not a fan of skill availability changing every second.

 

No, actually there IS a problem, it's not a win for everyone, this thread exists because it was NOT a win for the OP and he carefully detailed the problem. Oblivious optimism doesn't make problems go away, it just lets them get bigger.

The problem I see with this system is that while I and many others *CAN* have fun with a pile of mashed potatoes, it's not really a LOT of fun, and the downsides tend to pile up and grate on the 'player'. In this world of seemingly endless options, "do it our way and get used to it" is an attitude more in line with the dictates of government than of online video games. Individual fun factor is a huge concern, and not something to wave off blithely.

 

Um, that is what he JUST said. Vote with your deck BY USING THE CARD LOCK FEATURE.

 

Macroing does NOT equal botting. Key mapping is macroing, it just lets a player configure the system to respond better to how that player wants to push the keys. Botting uses an OUTSIDE PROGRAM, which is totally beyond the power of the random buttons system to stop, to operate the game controls. There is NO WAY to prevent this, the bot programmers will actively enjoy making workarounds to deal with security measures and firewalls, and the bot users will just buy the newest version.

Macroing lets the player plan. Now it can get ridiculous, a la RIFTS, where twenty powers are que'd on a single button and the computer just takes the first available, that lets the macro do your combat thinking for you. But an unthinking macro, that just attempts to use a power, or set of two powers in a fixed alternation, is not a bot. It doesn't even go into MAKING a bot, it still leaves all decision making firmly with the player.

What macroing REALLY equals is planning. And what the random card system prevents is planning. When I am circling an opponent on the mat, or in the street, I am not waiting for opportunities to randomly occur that let me do cool stuff. I am planning my moves and watching for the openings that let those moves come. When the opening comes I don't fill it with whatever random flailing occurs to me in the moment, I use it to execute that carefully planned out attack I've been saving up.

Having the skills not be available all the time is separate from having them be dealt to random keys all the time. One type of randomness I like, the other... well, I'm just gonna let you know that the focus penalty is not gonna stop me from locking my keys. Nothing would. If the penalty became great enough, I would respond by having my keys locked and my strategies worked out in advance in a different game.

A fixed tracking camera, implimented in a number of games, has the view automatically follow your current target. Once a target is selected, and you've communicated to the game 'I'm watching that guy!', you don't have to keep telling the game to KEEP WATCHING THAT GUY! You get to move, and use your abilities, and mind your surroundings, while it is assumed that you are still watching 'that guy'. That doesn't make it a camera on rails, it's actually a very good idea that would do SotA a world of good.

 

That is pretty much my experience with this release. The Mad Hermits video tutorials helped a little, but for me, the biggest issue is the amount of time I've put into this already just trying to set it up such that the skills would be effective enough to take on at least low level creatures. Once this system is well balanced in a future release, I would actually suggest either an in game tutorial to help set it up properly, and/or possibly a default card deck set up already so that all one needs to do is equip it. This would be useful for those who don't want to go through the tedious process of setting this up. As one who plans on playing this as a single player game, I just want to be able to focus on the main story without having to spend a great deal of time setting up the combat system.

 

I like the idea of a big set of starter build libraries as sort of "character archetypes" to get people in, and then players can start tweaking as they get more experience.

 

I think this would be a great idea! If your a new player who doesn't want to comb through the forums looking for answers and just wants to hop in and play figuring out how to build a workable deck can be pretty frustrating. Heck even as a not new player I found myself have to do my skills over and over again. Some basic templates to start with would be nice.

 

There's precedent for things like that in terms of RPGs with flexible skill systems, where they have some archetypes to use as starting points if you want.

 

Don't forget, in the actual game your character most likely isn't going to start out with a bushel of skill points.... Maybe more than 2, but after that you will have to level up to add new powers. So it will probably be a gradual thing, where you become intimately familiar with each of your new powers as you earn them.

 

plz not as final combat a random card throw system lol

my 2 cents how it could be done tacticly in an mmo which go the route of the old taget based system .......
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/f...tom-click-system-ala-age-of-conan-idea.13127/

 

Firstly, the wording on the question is very one sided and not biased towards clicking 'don't like the deck system'... that said, I like this innovative approach to combat.

 

I love the current system to bits! For me, gaming should be a combination of luck and skill, which the glyph system provides.

Agreed. When you start playing you won't have access to 80+ skill points. You might even rely solely on the damage of your weapon alone. Personally I would prefer starting with no skill points at all... It makes me feel like a kid again saving every penny in my piggy bank. Spitting, polishing and appreciating every single one I have. Agonizing over defence vs damage.