Um, I contributed to this?

So Troll!

 

heh.. I'm almost embarrassed to admit "Game Art & Design".. to be honest the curriculum at the time was.. less than impressive. I could've taught it in my sleep. But it's a piece of paper that says I know somthing.. which of course I do.. I just wish I had learned something from the degree.

 

Hey Hey! I have a Computer Engineering degree that I will NEVER put to use. But I am currently going to Savannah College of Art and Design for a Game Development degree. Sadly, I am learning mostly 3d Art stuff, I guess I should have known that because it IS an art school afterall

But I am teaching myself some programming languages and I have my very first programming class this quarter (next week!). Can't wait.

 

Hey at least you can say you're learning something! The 3D courses I had to endure were.. well let's just say I wasn't going to an specialized school. I was essentially beta testing the curriculum. They had taken most of our courses from the digital arts curriculum I think it was. They didn't even bother to adjust the material for us much less any of the discussion. Our "Color Theory" course.. was about color theory in marketing.. not art. Just to give you an idea.

Thankfully for me I was already self taught somewhat in Max, had taken a REAL art class and dabbled off and on in just about everything else game related (except for Foley). Ugh.. ok back on topic or I'll seriously be tempted to rant. lol

 

In the UK if you you were to pay someone 65k, the company would have to pay closer to 74k due to tax.....then on top of that there are all the on-costs....'cost per desk' etc etc. Then there are possible bonuses and benefits......you also have to remember that there is a management structure as well.........the number of people involved in SotA is also probably greater than you actually think.

 

If that is true, they should update their Dev Team Page. But I don't think it is, unless they are using freelancers to limit costs, and then sure, I can see that.

 

The original point was that this isn't a AAA budget. Unless Portalarium releases a full account of their expenses for the last 2 years we can sit here an speculate how much they've actually spent until we're blue in the face. Not that there would be much point.

A lot of people come in and judge the game without fully comprehending just what they're comparing it to.. or just how incomplete it really is. Then get all disappointed because it wasn't what they expected.. (which to me usually sounds like what they expect is a AAA beta)

 

Yeah. Or in this case, AAA Pre-Alpha But it's not and never will be, so many will be disappointed. Unless they come in and give it a go without much expectations, and then they may be surprised.

 

I don't know what the developers are being paid at Portalarium, but to me these figures look like great salaries for young blood; those either right out of college, or with 1-3 years experience. I would expect (and hope) the mid level to veteran level developers are bringing in more along the lines 90k - 120k. If not, I hope everyone is being offered stock options in the event of mad profits, or buyout.

I think your 2 mil estimate might be a little low.... I didn't run any numbers myself (sorry, I would have but I'm about to run out to the door to buy diapers), but personally I think your salary estimate, and overhead estimate is a bit on the low side. Don't forget about costs due to facilities, legal, employee benefits, marketing, software/media licensing, hardware, r&d, morale.

 

I think most people don't have any idea of what a pre-alpha normally looks like either. Much less an alpha. I remember actually getting into a public alpha test for Meridian 59 way back in the day. I don't think I've ever seen a public alpha since then. That was about 2 years before UO. Talk about low on features. We were walking around literally picking up weapons off the ground cause there was no other way to get them.

 

I know what you mean.

I wouldn't mind seeing complete transparency from the Devs though. I mean, some of the other Kickstarters have been doing it since Day One, and the public loves it. It lets them see where their money is going to. It also gives them a reason to WANT to pledge more if they think the company is actually using the pledge money correctly.

I would have pledged more by now, but sadly some things just doesn't seem to want to change for the better. And it has NOTHING to do with the game itself, that's the sad part.

 

This is their first kickstarter. I've been here since day 1 and I like to think my expectations are well grounded. I'm not going to make excuses and say everything Portalarium is going or has done is perfect.. there is a lot of room for improvement. But all things considered I don't think they're doing too badly. This project has a lot of firsts for them that they haven't been used to dealing with and it's easy for certain things (*cough* asset hub *cough*) to slip through the cracks.

I'm sure it must be a heck of a learning experience. One I hope they will take advantage of and do things better for EP2.

 

Indeed. I'd put it more at 4$ mill spent for all the overhead and employment so far (20 months, 30 avg employees).

Even if you went uber conservative and put down 800$ a week/avg per employee, that is still roughly 2.5 million over 2 years, and that is JUST salary.

The shedding of some of the staff to focus on resource building makes sense given the amount of income per pledge avg and the remainder in the cash drawer.

Being conservative, with no more drops in staff, I'd say they have a solid year of money with continued pledge average and remaining funds.

 

Portalarium have heart, but SotA is an unfocused mess. Others have mentioned that it all magically changes before launch. Hope so lol

 

Ok....name them.

 

I just want to clarify, I am still looking forward to this game and I understand that it's still in pre-alpha, but, for a game scheduled to be released this year, I expected it to be further along than what I've seen. Especially since it's been hailed as UO remade.

 

The beauty of a 200 million dollar(or whatever) game, just look at the detail on that rock. Sota is better with 5 mil....

 

Didn't ask if it was a traditional MMO... I simply asked how many of your awesome games produced for less than $5M, and are trying to accomplish what they are doing with this game?

Traditional or not, this is still going to be an MMO, which has its own set of development costs and woes. Traditional or not, this is still going to ALSO be a fully fledged single player offline game, complete with that additional set of development costs and woes, which can be mitigated to an extent with the development of the MMO stuff, but not entirely.

Tell me how you pay a staff of 30 to develop ANYTHING in two years, for less than $3M., when you consider their average salary per individual would be somewhere arounf $50k...?

 

This seems like the post of somebody who thinks programmers are wizards. Well to be fair i was 34 before i realised programmers are not wizards.

 

Actually, you didn't ask that at all in any of your posts. I responded to exactly what you posted.

No one is arguing whether it is an MMO or not, everything these days with a multiplayer component is going to consider itself MMO (as the term is so popular).

As for the fully fledged Single Player component, all it will be is an extension of the MMO component.

Taken directly from their About Page:

"Shroud of the Avatar: Forsaken Virtues is a new type of third person fantasy RPG that combines a single player narrative with a sandbox MMO. It is being created by a team that includes:Richard “Lord British” Garriott the creator of the Ultima series, Starr Long the original Director of Ultima Online, and Tracy Hickman the author of the beloved Dragonlance Novels and Dungeons & Dragons modules."

"

• Single Player Offline Mode: Players will adventure through over 40 hours of story in an interactive world where their choices have consequences, ethical paradoxes give them pause, and they play a vital part in weaving their own story into the immersive world and lore surrounding them.
• Selective Multiplayer Modes: If you want to go through the story online you can play with everyone in a single world with three different online modes (Single Player, Friends Only, and Open). "

What does that mean? To be honest, I have no idea, I am NOT a developer, however, judging by that, it means the SAME story will be in the MMO as the Single Player mode. So by ensuring the success of the MMO experience (which most people will be playing), they will ensure that those who don't want to participate will be able to enjoy the exact same content in the SP mode, just by themselves. [/quote]

I won't. I do not take care of their books. Again, it was just guesswork, if you want to know how much they've spent, ask them. Their team is very small. Who knows if they didn't agree to lower paying salaries with special bonuses after a certain amount of time or when it goes retail.