Will there be Skillsystem changes?

I like these cold sunday mornings, meeting all these people, having a hot tea or coffee and talking about roleplay
May be we could make a saturday evening or sunday morning hour in a choosen tavern to meet together for lunch or breakfast next time? Would be funny sitting around a huge table

 

People (and I) gave tons of reason along this thread. Seriously, you don't make any effort with this. I don't see why I would have to make effort to explain what I already said multiple times.
I lost enough time with people like you anyway. I don't know if you do that on purpose or not but it seems to me that you are not even worth a read. => Ignore list. Thanks. Good bye.

 

To me, from a RP perspective, you are either attuned to a school of magic or you are susceptible to it. It sounds to me like some of you just don't like that and you're using RP as the reason that they should change it. It just doesn't fly with me.

 

I do not undock RP from gamemechanics or gamemechanics from RP - sure some compromise need to be done, but if its is about my character and his skills i want to identify with him, i want to grew him, develop him not only from a gamemechanics view, but also from a roleplaying view, what is connected to gamemechanics.

i already pointed out that most people understand that RP has nothing to do with gamemechanics or skills and that the view at it isolated and undocked from skills.
My Point of View is completely different and with my opinion it leads also to sandbox gamemechanics like some already pointed out in this and other threads.

People arguing against it, seem to not see the whole thing imho about RP, Sandbox and gamemechanics, maybe because they never roleplayed at all or this way and have completely wrong things about RP in mind or confound it with socialising events and danceparties.

As long as the satisfied players are not honestly interested in the concerns others made and just answer things like:

i'm fine, my build is super, who the cap fit...., and things like that i dont feel taken serious and reduced to something what is not worth to discuss with and find compromises.
So - analyzing the threads more and more i also think some dont do it with evil intention, but they do it with a method and a method i don't like.

imagne the other way around, we would have a class system with hard caps and you were arguing you want be more versatile and have no limits and i answer you:
My Icewizard is fine and i have reached the cap and all i want - who the cap fit should them wear it. What you want will not happen, not worth the debate, please go and play something else what is more like what you want and let us alone because we are happy and we feel you destroy our garden eden. Maybe think of it like you can be in mind everything you want, you just dont have the skills, but hey its a RPG, you can be whatever you want to be, just imagine it. For example, you want to progress endlessly, well try to look at it this way: you progress every day, with every minute in the game, only the numbers dont count further, but you sure can imagine to develop and progress furher, or?
You want to be more versatile, more skills, more ammo types, more... - just imagine to have different types of ammo or imagine your skills are more than they are and about versatility, well you can try to do everything, have you ever tried to play with multiboxing - its all about what you make of it, or?

Exactly thats the way people argue here with us, who want things change to some degree. And thats not honest and don't take the others serious!

 

I think, it's not easy to find the right balance, even for @Chris, to have a "one-fits-all" system.

And I really(!) don't think, anybody wants to make negative points about concerns players make.

For example, take the talking about SOLO play and UO-like game feeling.
Same thing. People who never played Ultima (IV-VII), can't imagine, what they are talking about!
To say: hey, this game is fine, will not help them.
YES - this game is fine, if I don't expect other features
And yes, we can arrange with a huge of things.

But, if there could be a possibility to make a few changes, giving concerned players a better feeling - and taking nothing away from others! - would be worth to consider

1. To give a bonus for focus on less Skill(tree)s, would give them the power to form their character they want, without fearing about high end players, who skilled nearly everything ...

2. Having meaningful storyparts is a real good improvement for players who like this part. Taking nothing away for others ...

3. providing pvp and house features, fishing, taming abilities ... takes nothing away from others. And as I don't want to use these features - YET, I am happy for the players who like and receive them!

All theses features make the game more unique!

I think, the mixture of a lot parts, to address a wide range of player interests is THE bonus of this game

And if we try to understand the concerns of others, it is a good way to improve our skills, the game and this forum, too ...

 

Well, If I would only use water/ice magery, my resistance to fire would mean to have a permanent ice shield around.

To be resistant against death could mean to have a life shield. So always the opposite of a mage tree.
And as we know: there is no cure for CHAOS

May be the Shield-skills could give an answer how to handle a kind of resistance?
May be each shield should give an amount against other magic stuff?

So there should be thoughts about:
how much death power can go through a shield of ice?
Death power is a "cool" power, so would an ice shield prevent it? Hm... interesting stuff ...

On the other side: I can't be resistant against something I DON'T KNOW or I didn't have any (enchanted) armor to be save of it.
So enchantment could be the magic word to give armor (cloth, leather, chain, plate) -permanent- resistance against magic forces.

Again: As I provided my thoughts on page 1 of this thread - Focus on less skills could give a power bonus to more focused role players

 

Well if we want changes, we have to agree. I was noticing I have become a bit complaisant about some things since we are getting closer to release. I don't really like to read the back and forth I'm right, he's wrong type of threads or ones that feel like they are going that way. I try to read them to know how people feel but my mind starts drifting when that happens well or imo it seems to be happening. So lately my mind has been thinking and forming some different thoughts on this.
So my practice is given the system we have now what can we do with that?
So we have a skill based non capped system where everyone can do everything.(with a few soft caps I hear)
So what can we do with that to enhance or shift it so that we have a much more interesting system that covers some things people want to see?
Here is what i hear from people:
Some people want to specialize and play a role such as classes or types of players broken down to types like this:
Pure classes without deviating from their type: Pure Mage, Pure Warrior (doesn't use magic, heals with bandaids or potions), Pure Archer etc
Then there are the specialized types: Pure Ice Mage, Pure Fire Mage, Pure Death Mage, Pure Life Healer, Rogue/Assasin etc
Then there could be rolls like: tank, healer, dps any class (swordsman, archer, rogue etc)
Ok so you get the gist of what I am hearing people say.

Now the thing is the system we have does not totally support the specialization part, everyone has to hybrid their characters due to few choices in the dynamic of our combat system.
Everyone can do everything and in fact they have to do a lot of most things to pick up necessary resistances, protection, buffs, focus, strength, dex etc.

So Given the system we have, what can we do with it. Ok so I am taking this to my own thread. *cheers* everyone.

 

just one thing.... where are the Backers?
How many satisfied people are here playing the game?

i think many made their points about whatever issue they have, pvp, skillsystem, grind, quests, sologame, consequences....

and there are those who are fine with leveling all skills, grind the whole day, have no quests at all, solo everything, dont care for quests with consequences and are just happy and play...
But if these people believe they are enough to keep the game running and developing, then good luck, all the other customers who complained, gave feedbacks and made tons of threads with suggestions, ideas and requests are just shut down with: hey the game is cool like it is, shut up and play.

totally counterprodictive and some are just trolling and show: I dont care for you or your opinion and i take you not seriously.

This thread was before i did my feedback, before i leveld fire to adapt and loose identification with my char, this thread was a question to Chris and LB
and i am fine if they dont answer.

I asked you to not derail the thread

and here we are AGAIN!!!

Berek already asked me if he should close the thread - i am not against it, because nothing was about to answer my question if we can expect more changes and adjustment to the Skill System - but i have to admit some made good suggestion or give good explanations what i want to say here, especially @Paladin Michael and @Hornpipe

please try to avoid to write answers like:

I'm here to give feedback and not to accept things like they are - if its released and set in stone that nothing changes anymore, thats the day when i accept how things are and make a decision. You dont need to say sorry, that it is not what i want, we are here to give feedback and say what we want or what we like or dislike.

or this one:

Helpful or just a funny gibe?

I feel some people dont take me serious and mock or at least just say something to just express that they are against it in general that things get fintuned, more complex, more varied, allow more ideas, concepts, playstyles...

i find its somewhat ignorant to say: Hey i'm fine go to hell with your complaints.

YOU CAN THINK THAT ALL DAY LONG - but maybe dont post it and let others also share their opinion, let them make their suggestions and JUST DONT COMMENT IT AT ALL if you have nothing to add than to say no or to say nothing but turn somebodys concerns into ridicule.


thank you.


now @Berek its sure time to close the thread - an official answer has to come... hopefully...

 

ITYS

 

The easiest change that would promote specialisations would be if they changed the cost to learn skills depending on what you already had. It would not be a strong incentive but a gentle push.

 

The majority of players left after decay, that was the #1 cause of players leaving.

 

I'm not really a casual player, but these things i read where you need 80 in all skills to succeed is getting abit out of hand in my opinion. Cause you don't. Yes sure it opens alot of new options for different playstyles, but there's plenty of players who hook up with a healer and can play their archetype fighter class just fine or as an archer for example.

 

Silence can be an answer too. This is why we make threads and rinse repeat the same topics for years.

 

So, is it that in a game where you have total freedom to make your a build you like we are asking for archetypes like every other MMO, where you can put 1-3 more "points" in the same skill than me to be "different", or where you pick skill "A" over skill "B" to make you "different"? Because it seems to me that in a game where you have freedom to pick your skills, that this argument devolves into something akin to skill trees in WoW, Rift, or pick any other MMORPG out there.

And then it seems the argument is really about wanting to PvP. Which is fine. But I don't think the entire game needs to revolve around what makes PvP subjectively better - never mind that this was never a PvP-centric game.

You have freedom to RP your character however YOU want. This has the added pitfall of gimping your character by making the wrong choices - but they gave us an Obsidian Potion of Unlearning to fix that problem.

When I was younger, I went to school and learned geometry, calculus, statistics, biology, chemistry, etc. I think they boost my RL character somewhat, even though I don't currently use those skills. What is wrong with me taking a few heal spells, and taking a few of the passive buffs/defenses from other trees? What is wrong with me doing whatever I want however I want? What is wrong with total freedom?

The ONLY thing I think that needs to be done *prepares Flame Shield* is to allow decay to prevent people from literally getting every skill to 200 if they so chose, without a penalty. This is already the way things are. Yes, I am the only one that thinks that someone should not have 200 GM's without having to pay a steep price for it. With great power.....

It's unfortunate that tons of people left the game because of that, but that in and of itself should not be a reason for changing things.

Besides, wouldn't it be worse if they literally coded that you CAN'T GM 200 or so skills? I mean, literally no one in any RP game, book, movie, etc. is ALL POWERFUL. That would just be a boring RP experience.

 

The quote you used to accusing me just asked you to demostrate what parts of my no-archetypal build is not competitive in your opinion (nothing personal and not offensive at all), as i already said you have to demotrate your thesis and your feedbacks must reflect the truth.

The sad part is how you're trying to assign faults to all those who have tried to explain something to you, quoting selected messages hoping for a punishment for contradicting your idea.
This attitude is reflected in many of the discussions on the forum, "Cannot I be right? then I'm a victim".

It is also weekend for moderators, it is unnecessary to insist on the immediate closure of the thread, extending this request with quotes and complains.
At this point I also agree: Close this thread because it worsens day by day, hoping that tomorrow someone will not create another identical as often happens.



PS: In my personal opinion, rejecting the help of other players and waging war versus them will definitely not help you to improve your results, but as i said is just my personal opinion.
We have to work together and not one against each other.

 

How feasible would it be if we cap the skill level of the opposite skill. Like a fire mage can only train water skills up to a soft cap of say lvl 80. If he wishes to pursue advancement in water, he will have to visit the water advanced trainer, who will tell him that to advance to a highest level of water, you need to give up your strength in fire. meaning, lower down to fire skills to level 80 via a obsidian scroll of unlearning.

You still have the flexibility of changing specialisation.

Please don't bash this noob. He's just curious.

 

Or... just thinking out loud. Say a player, Mac3 has all Fire levels of 100 and all Water 100 now. He is forced to make a decision. Fire specialization or Water specialization. If he chooses fire, his water is still 100, but the strength is suppressed to that 80.

He wants to specialize in water, he goes to the water advance trainer which removes the water restriction, and puts the restriction on fire. This way, he never loses his levels. Just suppressed. Maybe the GM icon still shows but different colour?

 

I specialize in water and fire. I see them as complementary not antagonistic. I want to combine fire and ice arrows into Greek fire arrows. I like to fire arrow to pull a distant target, then ice arrow to slow them down while the fire slowly burns. But don't worry, a specialist archer is still killing the same enemy many times faster.

I like diverse, creative decks and builds - to me it's more interesting and fun. I'd prefer a way to accommodate hardcore specialist role players that does NOT decrease playing flexibility for those that prefer less stereotypical roles.

 

Fair enough. Perhaps a mix of 4 schools of magic?

Can that actually be done?

Say like, to display a title of "Master of the Elements", your life, death, moon, sun, skills are capped (reduced) to 80 or lower.

 

The problem with those limitations are, mages are now using a bunch of different schools of magic against you, so limiting people is leaving weaknesses and could lead to people not being able to do certain content, maybe even main line quest content. Its not like being a generalist does not have a price, I have to level more different schools and can only use so many at once, yet when I die pay the price for all of them. As well, I could be stronger at certain things if I specialize, but weaker vs other things. Why not just let people choose the way they want to play and not limit them.