Will there be Skillsystem changes?

Here's the problem as I see it.
Lets say I want to be an effective ...I dunno, for example's sake, lets say melee weapon user of (pick type)

I really need to level ....

Weapon Tree
10 or so skills

Preferred Armor Type Tree
8 or so skills

Tactics Tree
Healthy
Train Strength
Choice of Stance
Fortify Defenses
3 Offhand skills if i want to dual wield
Weapon/Armor Preservation
A reasonable amount in heavy lifter to actually carry loot

Subtlety Tree
Train Dexterity
Armor Weak Points
A reasonable amount in safe fall to not die from tripping over your feet
Poison if I want to use posion
Several 'optional' skills depending on playstyle

Focus
Heightened Awareness
Train Intelligenfce (at least a bit, for focus pool)
Innercalm/
Followthrough/
Concentration to some extent for focus costs/interrupt/fizzle

That's over 30 skills, skipping a lot of optional items, that directly affect my ability to wield a melee weapon or how effective I am at it.
Then you've got....
Elemental resistances (attunement - so, um, ALL the magic skills?)
But speficically:
Str of Earth, Enlightenment, Air's Embrace for stat buffs
Douse for not being on fire
Ignite weapon if that's your thing

Passives of clear melee benefit, such as sun eater/sun worship for str, moon eater/moon worship for dex, sympahty of stone/bulwark of earth for resistance/avoidance/str, various options on elemental shields, etc.

Then there's also...
Various stackable heals if desired (soothing rain, elysian, healing grace, etc)
Life tree if you want to heal yourself with that
Death tree if you want to heal yourself with that

Essentially, even if you eschewed all offensive magic and just focused on being effective at dealing damage with a melee weapon, you're easily looking at 50 or so skills that need to be levelled up.
NOT levelling up some of these passives isn't really making a different "build" its just robbing yourself of bonus passive stats.

That's just the way its designed.

We aren't going to get away from this "push to be a generalist" situation unless we completely took apart the skill system and started fresh with a clear plan, but we're far too far along for that to be possible.
The only suggestion I could really make at this point would be to add additional benefit to specialization to justify the extremely high costs of pushing anything past 100.. Ancev's skill mastery thread is an interesting idea in the right direction.
Of course, as long as we have skill decay, investing in skills beyond 100 is just asking to be punished. If we had a more sensible system though, decay wouldn't even be necessary. Its not necessary now, but it would be even less necessary.

 

Oh did you leave alpha before me? Absolutely agree with everything else you said but that line is a complete lie so long as we are in alpha

 

Just getting ten of the magic skills in each tree to 40, cost hardly any exp and will help a lot. With 3 mil exp. I was able to get my level 63 character done the 3 main questlines and the shroud quest. its was 1.270 million to get all the magics to 40, the 4 strategy trees to 40 both armor trees to 40 shields to 40 and swords to 40. The rest I put into blades, life and water magic. You don't have to gm all the magic trees for res, Sara does not have them gmed, and does perfectly fine. The way you are all making it sound though is that you need to gm everything, and this is simply not true.

 

Actually, the game push your way of playing (aka training everything and using hybrid magic decks) onto me. A game mechanic which is unable to reward every single play style is not a good game mechanic. I should not have to rely on a party to do what you can do alone as long as my play style has some consistency, of course.

I don't remember our last and only encounter in the same way as you do, it seems. From my own experience, you don't back up such words by your actions.

 

Some of us already made suggestions which doesn't involve such a changement and which would help to mitigate this a lot.

 

You are rewarded for what ever you skill into by those skills getting stronger. And the decay system and the way it multiplies depending on the level of the skill, if you can find my post when that change was suggested, I said this was going to be the outcome of it, people will just end up getting different skills before taking certain ones higher. This is not always the case though, and the people who did specialize are reaping the benefits of staying on the path they chose

I don't remember it all all, when did I kill you? Did you attack me first? As for helping people, I have done a TON in ways of helping people, even look at stundorns post, kaeshiva's, or many of the other people I have helped. Sorry, but I do help people WAY more then I have killed people.

 

This discussion is going around in circles with arguments like that. Of course, I reap benefits with high skills, thank you. But we were talking about balance. When you have to play tens time more to get the same benefits or less, specialization is not good enough. I hear Sara this, Sara that, everytime we are talking about specialization. But first Sara had to train every skills. Secondly, Sara is one of the highest experienced character. Find me ten exemple of people who are able to compete in PvP and who did not feel compelled to train everything. Ask for screenshots to see how their skills are distributed in each tree. After, we talk.

K'rul. You were with one of your guild mate. She attacked me without any provocation and killed me, then vanished.
Then, when I met you, you were in fight with the last Monkey wave. I fired two shots on one of those monkeys without any bad intent and you killed me after I unwielded my weapon, without even trying to talk. That was three months ago now.

Of course, I knew the risk as I was PvP flagged, but I never forget when someone is just behaving like that. The picture I got of you this day is far from the helpful people who want to cooperate. But anyway, all of this is off topic from the moment you tried to convince people about your good intentions. We are not here to talk about that.

 

Spinok the great, Fzol, titania dragonsbane, just to name a few I know, I am sure there are others as well. Some of these people might have some skills in the magic tree but I'm sure they are not that high.

I do not have any control over what others do. I do not take kindly to people who try and KS me, even if you just fire a couple shots, that is one of my buttons. The other one is people who talk about their macros, I absolutely despise macroing and botting. I do not have any control over what others do.

 

im desperately trying not to lose it... but when will it end???? we who levelled all our trees etc did so because we like to be versatile so we can adapt to any situation Not just PVP but also PVE. you simply can not expect to be able to do the same as we do with one set Deck/Skill set up. it just doesnt work, some mobs/players will be extremely resistant to your method therefore you will NOT BE EFFECTIVE. so you have 3 options in that situation, 1. you Find a way to overcome this challenge by adapting and using their weakness. 2 you can move on to something else and not waste your time. or 3. Just stand there locked in a battle to see who falls first. You act like its so damn hard/expensive to raise the other trees when it really isnt. levelling them to 40 is so inexpensive its unreal. Yes it is your right as a player to play how you want but dont stand there and complain when you cant do what we do because we levelled everything to give ourselves the best chance in any situation.

 

You dont get it

 

OMG you're right.. i totally dont get it.. i totally dont have 7k hours in the game.. i totaly didnt experience wipes.. i totally havnt been a new character in persistence..

But i do get it... It is you and countless others who refuse to see it..

im just gonna go back to earning lots of exp instead of whining on the forums

 

Do that I only play forums, game not worth it

 

So a game that you don't even play, you just post on the forums of and say other people that do play do not understand?

 

Then you don't have any exemple. It's just as simple as that. That's precisely the problem. A design problem.

@HogwinHD I can confirm that you don't get it at all. Sorry. Man, I can't read all this topic in your place.

Do not try to blame someone else. When I see someone in combat, except very exceptional cases, I usually give him a hand, firing a few shots, slowly, to not draw the target's attention on me. I even stated this long ago on this same forum. In your case, I only shot 1 rapid fire and 1 aim shot, nothing even close to be enough to kill a simple wolf in some case. So about a Shock Monkey in K'Rul test room.... But again here is not the place to promote your activity as a tutor. And obviously, if your goal was really to clarify this with me, and not to make a press release, that discussion would already out of the public side of this forum. That's precisely the Private Messages purpose. @Berek

Once again, rather than dwelling on the substantive arguments, I see who is trying to revive personal quarrels to gain moderation. Sorry, but I'll let you do your monologue alone, guys.

 

you keep telling yourself i dont get it... im quite happy Earning exp and not whining on the forums.. its okay i get it.. id be jealous of me too!! everyone can do what we do.. they just choose not too. thats not our fault

 

Oh I guess when you put 90% of you exp into a specialized build, your not a specialist.

OH yes, because I really need your help on something LOL. Maybe you should start by asking if the person wants your help first? If you don't, you look like a KSer. I brought up about helping people because you were talking about competing with me. I just think its better to cooperate with people. Try to have a rational discussion, stating examples, but go ahead and see it as a personal attack, clutch that grudge.

 

stop it - just derails now

 

Obviously, you have problems with maths. GM everyhing is 550M xp points. Getting a single tree to 120 is something like 300M in the worst case. 90% you said ? Even leveling everything to 80 would take something like 150M, if my memory is correct. The same amount of experience needed to take one skill to 150. *censored for the sake of this topic*

 

can i just ask... is what you are getting at that all skills/trees should cost the same to level?

 

Sara did the cheapest way to pull off 80 attunement in each school, The rest of Saras exp is into his build for blades, heavy armor, tactics is all included into that. Now what % of 800-850 million is 80 attunement in each school? Remember, only the top 10 skills count for attunement, and he would keep the more expensive skills lower then 80, and the cheaper ones higher to compensate. Andar is at 750 million exp, and has nearly 200 million into life power alone, and tons onto the rest of his life tree. Like 25% of andars exp is into one skill alone, and we have not even added up the rest of his life tree.