Early Dev+ Knight backer - this game is not commercially ready.

Been playing off and on since early 2014. I dont say much, I usually just let folks do what theyre going to do and trust that they're working diligently.

However it's been 3 years of this. You'd figure with all the various passes and whatnot folks would have updated the Avatars by now.

If it simply annoys me, its probably been enough to convince alot of others to simply not play. Fix the avatars. Cloaks can be 'seen through' routinely, avatars do not always stick to the ground, facial hair is rigid and beards can just plain cut into the rest of the avatar. The list goes on.

The UI is functional, and is growing, but is far from complete. Asheron's Call had a better feeling UI at the time of release, and it was widely accepted to be one of the worst UI's in the genre.

The quest lines are not just difficult to follow - they are annoying to follow.

Towns literally feel dead. The game feels empty.

I could say more but let's see if folks are really interested in a critique. I could toot my own horn about how I played UO or was a huge Ultima fan, but nobody cares and you've heard it before.

So instead what I'll say is "I keep coming back looking for an improved product, and all I see is more stuff being sold in the stores."

So, guys... what's up? Is the game going to be improved from pre-Alpha state, or have we really just been playing the finished product since the beginning, and been waiting on the quests?

 

Yes we have a ways to go still for the game to be ready. We need constructive feedback from everyone to make sure the game is release ready, not complaints. That is our job as much as theirs to listen to feedback and implement changes and fixes to give us the best release possible. Here is one of the lists that Darkstarr posted on this in case you missed it.

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/forum/index.php?threads/q4-2017-schedule-update.100684/

 

I thoroughly enjoy how folks say "feedback not complaints". This is feedback. It's a short list. Now folks can discuss it.

A complaint would be "OMG THIS SUXX I QUIT!"

Obviously I've stuck around for 3 years. I'd like to see some of the products addressed. However I wont be so vain as to tell them how to go about doing it. There are issues in all of the above areas though that are rather glaring. They need some extensive review.

 

Define feedback? Because where I come from feedback is letting folks know what you think, not doing their job for them.

Perhaps you're confusing feedback with suggestions.

Besides, you'd think they'd already be aware of severe graphical problems and the nature of their UI.

Fine. I'll offer a suggestion: I suggest folks cease talking about upcoming release dates and cease putting out reskinned assets, and focus on assets that are already in the game that are still not working correctly, 3 years after their initial release.

 

ugh. work in progress. lets move on. check back in 60 days

 

It's a fine line sometimes and a lot of it how people interpret tone and how you come across. Did you sound like you put a lot of thought into it or did you sound like you're just rattling off a list of personal peeves? etc.. It helps if you at least propose a way to solve the issues you perceive.

Did you give solid examples for everything on your list? You say quest lines are annoying to follow? But you don't explain how? I think that's what some people are looking for here.

Honestly, we've been hearing a lot of the same things for the last 3 years and we're finally entering the stage where we're pretty much out of pre-alpha and more solidly into alpha. Fewer features are being added and a lot more content is going in and the emphasis on polish.. fixing some of the things you mention.. is increasing. As they've been saying.. 80% of the quality goes in during the last 20% of development.. and we're just at the beginning of that stage.

Also not to get hung of on when they thought they would or will release. Not sure how you feel about the initial release date from kickstarter but when they raised more than their target of 1 million that original release date was already history. Bigger budget means they can do more.. which is going to take longer etc. Every release date they've ever given is no better than a rough guestimate based on the current situation at the time. The farther away they are the less accurate it's going to be. I'd say even now they're still guessing.. but accuracy has gone from something like 1% to 85%

Going by Portalarium's (now internal) definitions.. Alpha is feature complete.. Beta is content complete..

 

Yeah, I mean I do think the game has gotten a lot better over the past six months, BUT there is still such a long way to go. The add-on store will always be a point of contention with me, but I recognize it is a revenue driver for Portalarium. The problem, like you pointed out, is that there are still a ton of kinks that need to get ironed out and when you tie in all the new content they are trying to add to the game, things get pushed back. It definitely get's frustrating.

 

I did give a fair example with the cloaks.

As for the quests, folks are quite aware that the quests can be tedious, running from place to place without much clarity. While that's all well and good for some gamers, literally running around an entire town speaking to blacksmiths without any real idea where the blacksmiths in town are to begin with, ehhh... that just adds layers of tedium on, creating a rather unsatisfying onion. Completing a quest doesnt leave a feeling of reward. It leaves a feeling of "oh thank God that is over with."

We're not in Pre-Alpha anymore. We're in Early Access. The game has only 2 good reviews on Steam. The rest demolish it. I'd love to see the product succeed. I'd love to have not wasted a grand on a castle that nobody will visit and that I cant get my friends to come enjoy. But so far I cant. Friends shake their heads and go "Let's wait for this game, it just looks cooler". And I look at this castle and think "This would have been a fantastic home... in 2000. People would have loved it. But it's 2016, and folks arent looking for UO2 anymore."

Actually its 2017.

I've been thinking about saying something for a while. But I wanted to be respectful and wait for folks to do some polishing phases they'd been talking about.

 

I said Portalarium's "internal" definitions for a reason. "Early Access" means nothing except "not finished".. which can be anything from Release 1 to 1 day before commercial launch. Saying we're in "Early Access" doesn't mean we're not in pre-alpha.. it doesn't mean we're not in alpha and it doesn't mean we're not in beta.

Also means very little at this stage. What will matter is the end product. Still, no game is literally for everyone. Personally, it doesn't mean squat to me if a game is just flashy and pretty. I want something solid that I won't get tired of after the first year like so many other games out there.

 

Could you go back to your OP and edit it to be more constructive? I understand your grievances but this isn't a good/healthy way to air them.

 

No. This isnt about how I say something and my communication skills. This is about having a viable, entertaining, and appealing product.

If you'd like to refine my point and demonstrate your understanding of my grievances, feel free. Perhaps with a bit of community interest in some honest dialogue we can move forward. If you'd like to however, turn this into a thread about me, then I hope you are not representative of the majority voice here. If you are, this product is doomed.

 

Most posts that don't offer constructive criticism get closed down (rightfully so) so I'm just trying to help. There's no need to be upset.

 

While I agree with much of your assessment of the game as it now stands, I'm pretty sure a lot of that can and will be fixed when they get around to it. Personally, I wouldn't recommend this game to anyone yet, without a bucketful of caveats. However, I look forward to inviting friends soon(er or later).

I don't expect anyone to follow all the dev posts, telethons and all. I try to follow much of it and I know that many of your concerns are known by the devs and they agree that some things still suck. At this point in development it's all about scheduling to make the most of an increasing set of inter-dependencies.

You don't have to believe me. But, please, check in again when most agree that SotA is ready for launch.

 

Hi Magyar!

I would highly suggest you follow the weekly updates, quarterly updates, weekly livestreams, etc., that we put out on a regular basis. Everything is there on what we work hard to improve, the hundreds of items we put in the game (that are craftable), improvements to the quest line, etc.

See here please:

https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/?cat=12

If you have any questions on a specific point, or any specific concerns we might be able to address, let us know!

 

Hi Berek,

Thanks for your reply. I'm familiar with the updates, I actually follow them rather regularly and every few months check in and play for as long as my interest holds up. I firmly believe in giving every product I am interested in a fair shake, even if initial impressions are not fantastic. I played Darkfall and Entropia Universe for years under this premise and found Entropia to be rather rewarding (and very much like old Ultima Online). However some aspects can always be improved upon, and you cant play one game for the rest of your life!

I am happy you guys touched on the UI in your plan. That's excellent, however I see no mention of avatar polish, and if I may continue to be frank for a moment: If a player feels their character is flawed, they will not play that character.

If they see holes in the cloak, or the cloak suddenly turning into a bib (as happens on my FX 8350 RX480 system (and all other systems Ive played SOTA on, so I assume its consistent), they will quickly dislike their character, fail to identify with it, and move on to a product that satisfies whatever they are looking for in an avatar.

This is very important.

I'm currently exploring the new user updates ingame, but yeah, some quests are still nauseatingly tedious, and it again comes back to avatar identification. If folks dont feel like they are achieving something early on, they wont stick around for late game content which can be more time consuming. Right now it feels like the early quests are a bit more like late game quests, long and drawn out. Theres no character investment yet, so its too early to do that! They need to be fast paced, get folks interested in being their avatar and in the world.

The cities also need to be more lively, but I dont have any suggestions on how to accomplish that...

 

Yes sorry I was not helping the way I put what I said. Yes we have a lot of issues still. I've been out of town and away from the game for 2 months helping my mother who has poor health and I come back and the game is still stuttering.*sighs*.

I absolutely love the tree creature (reaper). What a fantastic job was done on him. He is perfect for the game and I love how there's not a ton of them standing around and that they blend in so nicely with the other trees.

Now I can picture occasional giant rock creatures coming out of the rock cliffs blending in pretty perfectly and wishing they are both harvest-able instead of lootable, as with all our elementals.

I have heard about new Quests and I'm hoping for things that help to connect the world and make us want to explore and play. I really think so much more is needed to pull it off. I have a huge list myself on my ideas of ways to do that. Those who know me have heard my song and dance. I'm sure I'll perform it many more times to rally for this game to have the best release. I'm still hoping for 6-8 months or more development before release to address all we need to address before release.

 

Aye... I agree with the OP that the game isn't ready for release - I personally have a hunch that it's still in development...

Even unfinished, I love the game and highly suggest that Portalarium staff keep getting up in the morning, showing up to work, and developing the game until it is finished.

 

Not to throw gas on a fire, but if the first three years represents 80% of the development, that makes 9 more months to get to 100%...

 

Could all just please stop preaching others this "Feedback Definition" posts.
I find it actually insulting.

I seriously think this is not the job of other community members to play the judge.
Let a Developer decide it.

Example:
Also even a "This is not UO" short feedback or 1000 writing only 2 words like "combat suxs" or "Game rocks" is feedback. The amount also counts how many post it i argue.

Because it is a sign i may have to adjust my Public Relation and Communication as Customers are not getting the message out that this is not UO.
If someone writes "Game Rocks" - great - i am on track as a Developer with what i am doing with this customer. ( No need to tell more!)

Did anyone change the messaging after the 200 posts saying "not UO"?

Maybe spiritual successor to UO and Ultima needs to be deletet in the Game Description.
Seems like causes wrong expectations.

How about instead: A new Game from Richard Garriott the creator of Ultima and Ultima Online.
Then it is clear for the customer. This
"spiritual successor" wording has caused tons of confusion over the past

Let the Customer decide itself if he finds connections to Ultima or Ultima Online.


But back to my subject - stop it please telling others what is feedback or not! Please.

If it is feedback lies in the Eye of Beholder.

 

agree
same for snow in Houses - you buy a house, want to live in a snow biome and have this immersion breaking bug.
Would it be possible to fix such things before release?
Do we get the snow Versions of everything what can be placed outside?
I mean you sell things for winter and you sell cloaks, but there still have bugs.

looking forward to winter Telethon and something aequivalent to the fire statue and fire armor you did for winter/ ice/ water.
and of course the game improves and i am mostly happy with it!

Go on and keep up the good work!!!