Guild Warfare Feedback

you also have to take in the age of the avarage player here. It might have gone down over the last couple years but before the prominent ages of people where 35 -70. Not so much of the twitch crowd but many people from the Ultima series/UO players.
I am lost at this implementation really.

 

Yes, I understand where you're coming from. I would argue that your nirvana is short sighted and flawed however. You're going to have a "kingdom" that is underpopulated and unfun for the masses. You're going to have PVP where the deck is stacked against anyone not in a guild of 20 or more, and the highest level people always win.

That's a system that will only serve a very small percentage of players and make pvp a meaningless activity.

 

Nope, it just puts my guild out of any guild combat. We have too many crafters and RPers to be flagged open PvP. I really liked the idea of Ravicus with RP guild combat. But, as I have said 1000 times, I loath open PvP. (I know, I know. Great for those of you who love it. More power to you.) But what it really means is the "guild warfare" for us will be a couple guilds getting together in somebody's arena basement and playing there.

As for insurmountable challenges I just don't believe it. The team has worked on a shoe-string budget and produce a game-to-be that has major studios rethinking how to do it. You've done some serious innovation. I just don't believe there is no way to solve the guild war problem save full on open PvP for all guild members.

Just off the top of my head, there must be some kind of parameters for considering if someone can join a team (like the team is already full). So, it could check guild membership. Warring guild members can't team. Simple. If the guilds declare while opposing members are teamed, the affected members are auto booted from the team. (Yes, inconvenient in mid battle, but we should watch our guild chat anyway.)

Healing, simple. You have to have the appropriate flag to heal someone. That is, PvP can heal PvP or those in guild combat. (Think hired mercenaries here.) BUT if you are PvE flagged you cannot heal some who is PvP flagged or in guild combat.

In fact, it seems making a Guild Combat flag would be nicest for players. Then it become simpler for players. PvP gets PvP. GC gets GC. And PvE gets PvE. (I know, not so easy for dev team.)

Just a thought.

 

Not sure about the need for a large guild to make PvP possible.

In UO it was rare that we operated with more than say 5 or 6 players in raiding/general PvP. It's all about having tactics and being organised......that is something that large guilds are typically bad at.

 

If it's just "dueling for guilds", plus if someone tries to pull a "blue healer" they get flagged for Open PvP (not "dueling", with confirmation), doesn't that take care of itself? No worry of folks flagging against their own guild, and the warring guild can then take care of the person interfering through standard Open PvP. Sure, it's a way to get from Guild PvP to Open PvP, at least for one scene, but it's better than what is proposed now.

Lots of people will NOT flag for PvP, and if guild leaders can force that, they won't join guilds. Defeats two systems.

 

Nope here is my suggestion.

The player picks thier guild. That guild could have a no war policy all the way to war vrs all guild policy. Put the choice in the hands of the players. Don't force anyone into anything and allow players/guilds decide how much blood to spill.

Sandbox.

 

I believe the choices being made for pvp are a combination of things.

1. People that don't understand the macro realities of PVP. Meaning that Trammel teaches us that if you have a safe zone, people will GAME there and only venture to the risky areas when they think they can win. This cuts the risky population down into small groups of wolves and it becomes less fun for everyone.

2. There are many competing playing styles in this game. Many of them don't like pvp or don't want harsher pvp mechanics. In an effort to persuade them to "try" pvp, we're getting a lot of funky mechanics that really just make it easier for the wolves to exploit attacks of opportunity and the byproduct is that it will be an even harsher pvp environment for those that "try" it.

3. There are people in this community that have good intentions but have horrible horrible ideas that are entirely based on their own siloed point of view, and unfortunately we are seeing the results of those ideas right now.

 

Thank you!

 

I think that's an understandable stance to take. But it assumes that people shouldn't have the option to be in a guild socially and also pvp in guild warfare. It's not inclusive enough.

Also, this is not a PVP based game (unfortunately) and the population is not (I don't expect) going to be such that we can afford to exclude people. It may not seem like it right now, but I believe choices that further segment the potential pvp population will only hurt the overall pvp population.

I'm saying this as someone that would like to see my PVP town filled to the limits. I don't want a few small groups of PK's. I want a full functioning town of people that are diverse in their playing styles. I want that because I think it's the only way to achieve success for this game and my town.

I could probably count on two hands the number of active PK's in this game right now. We shouldn't be in the business of trying to create Darkfall in the middle of SOTA, it's not going to work.

 

Below are some of the messages I am analyzing for ideas:
From another forum thread that I posted on:

My observation about the implementation of Guild Warfare so far is this (an I am likely wrong, but trying to boil things down for myself into simplest terms):

1. Guild Warfare's primary purpose appears to be to show 'Statistics' between guilds that declare fighting against each other, create some leader boards, etc..
2. To do this, there is an assumption that the guilds involved in Guild Warfare are by nature already 'fighting guilds' and enjoy combat ... perhaps all members are PVP flagged anyway.
3. If all guild members in a guild declaring Guild Warfare are not PVP flagged, they all become PVP flagged across the realm, because of Point #2 above -- they are all fighters anyway but want to get some statistics behind their warfare, and maybe some rewards.
   1. So this is an "en mass" PVP flagging for all guild members, and guild members need to know that (as they are not flagging themselves for PVP; their guild master is, and they may not know they are PVP flagged until they log in.) -- this is one of the contentious points.
4. This seems to be mainly a mechanical Statistics system for PVP warfare, not something that is focused on Roleplaying PVP guilds with storylines for isolated PVP combat. So this may not be the solution for combat between RPing / 'dueling' guilds.

I don't think I have recommendations and solutions ... sorry... But, these are my observations so far.

Thanks!

 

The player gets to decide how inclusive it is. If they want to see guild warfare all the gotta do is find a guild who meets thier needs. People seeing beatdowns all over town/other areas will either wanna get some or avoid the whole mess. This is supposed to be a sandbox game, play as you choose all Portalarium has to do is provide the systems

 

I think people should just choose their guild (if they want to be in one) very carefully.

 

+1 @Chris

I think you are going in the right direction for most PvP players.
War is war and a lot UO players will be happy to know the details of your vision.

Good job !


-Abydos

 

Winfield, I always appreciate your input. One thing glares out at me from this is the word assumption. That is a bad word to use in a community like this.

 

Yeah, I think that's always good advice.

And from a PK perspective it would be FANTASTIC because how easy would it be to get some of these guild leaders into a PVP war they couldn't finish? I think that would be fairly easy.

But it's not good for the long term health of the game, and it's also not good for solo players (like me).

 

Its all good unless you liked UO RP guild warfare, in which I did. It allowed you in guild warfare to not allow artifacts and blessed items. Everything was gm or less. You could have wars with people that wanted to role play the story that you narrate. But not here, not with this system....Its sad that a game that is over 20 yrs old has a better guild war system than this.

 

Why? They have to accept to begin with......it's their choice.

 

@Chris and others.

Do you know what one of the first rules of any game is? People have to agree to play.

If you look at any team sport, or any kids game (dodge ball, tag, king of the hill), this is one of the constants.

There's no game on this planet where people are forced to play when they don't want to. No game that is fun anyway. And that's a MAJOR flaw in this design.

 

How is anyone being forced to do anything here? You might look at this and think its awful......but there are many players who have stayed clear of SotA because it was lacking in terms of risk and PvP......imo this goes a long way to fix that problem.

 

ok I am lost at the moment, What are we talking about forcing people to do? Not being a pest, just lost track lol