Why do we insist on pvp Zones?

Yes and see how messy it was and how much it didn't work out?

The introduction into the arena was for newbie players to test their equipment. It is nothing big or fancy at all and isn't played by many. And Albion solely has people who love sandbox PVP/PVE. So if you want to prove my point that an arena in a sandbox game is a dumb idea.. yeah right. Bercilak did against our suggestions. Next patch is back on guild vs guild mechanics
Also your argument that people are equal there is completely wrong wrong wrong. You characters masteries matter much more in the arena, because only gear IP is capped.
I know you probably have no clue about albion as you have in this game here. But I now know what that hat you're wearing in that pic is for

ALSO you can see how they have done money wise so far and how Portalarium did. Also every person can see how populated SotA was once and is now?

 

Yay, we have successfully reverted to comparing consensual PvP to non-consensual PvP. When what we should be talking about is the wall between the two.

Right now, as show in the last few posts, we have a belief that Solo/Friend/Oracle keeps people out of PvP. This isn't the wall it's the shelter people use to avoid the wall. The wall is the belief that join in on the PvP will be met with loss.

Find ways for people to be successful in PvP then we will have more people in PvP.

 

Agreeing to that point. May I point you here.
Making people successful by artificial boundaries doesn't work. Add more purpose to PVP and incentive to teach others and group and you will see results and maybe some decide to come back playing again as well.

 

Artificial boundaries is the world we live in. SotA is defined by consensual PvP and selective multiplayers. There is no breaking those down. The boundaries created by other stuff is my focus. Level gaps, gear gaps, group size gaps, are a few.

I'll give your link a read but from the skim through, factions are boundaries also. The same thing can happen with factions. The belief that loss will happen when joining PvP can push the bulk of the players to one faction over the others. The largest faction becomes the new shelter.

Always a challenge when adding substance to open PvP. Add too much and it's not open while keeping it too open will end in open PvP killing itself.

 

I hate the way that backers have divided themselves into different groups -- PvP vs PvE, SP vs MP, story vs. sandbox, social vs RP, etc. -- and many have decided they don't ever to come in contact with anything that's not in their playstyle. Its making the game very incredibly boring. People go to their little corners in the game world -- as much as they're allowed to, anyway -- and repeat the same activities. If a lot of backers had their way, not only would no scenes be strictly PvP, but PvPers would never have to PvE either, and PvEers would never have to enter towns because they'd have pets or servants access their bank and vendors for them, and you could instantly teleport wherever you want free. Nobody would ever have to do what they don't feel like doing.

I'm sorry, but this is what makes for a boring game.

And then people will complain the game is boring.

 

Yeah you're right. Of course the world needs its own logic. But the tighter those boundaries are the more you limit the players.
It needs to be fine tuned. Absolutes are always bad.

@redfish sums it up. We need to find systems were everyone plays together... The game segregates too much already that why almost everyone is feeling bored.
IMHO in the long run having systems that makes me help other players, and makes others maybe risk getting killed it the best compromise and frankly something @Lord British mentioned he wanted to do.

 

100% agree.

The wall between play styles isn't really what I am talking about. The wall I am talking about is within PvP itself though. For example: the cost of PvP. Would more people flag PvP IF there was no cost to losing? No decay, no ransom, no time wasted getting back into the goal in mind.

If we assume combat is fun, character development is fun, then removing the cost of PvP is the answer. We still need more than that but that's all it will take to get people into PvP.

 

One would think that inserting meaningful PvP into a mmorpg has been done before.

 

What would be the cost now?

 

1: level required to be viable
2: gear required to be viable
3: repair costs
4: ransom cost
5: down time from corpse runs

That’s probably not all but good enough to cover the point.

 

Sorry but it won't work without a cost. That cost however must be balanced I agree. The factors you listed are non issues for an average gamer. And that should be the aim for Portalarium. Not the ultra casual nor the powergamer.

 

ah cost to participate not cost of dying, gotcha. though you can go ahead and strike that ransom thats only misleading.

 

@DarkStarr
@Chris
@Lord British

Long ago there was talk about a MACHINE that was to be set aside for PvP alone.

THE MACHINE parts could be gathered but could be stolen or THE MACHINE build from it stolen.

All that were to be a part of it could only be in PvP mode

and once constructed THE MACHINE was suppose to give some bonus to the group in possession of it.

What is the ETA on this? I'm not much of a PvPer but this could be the thing that gives purpose to play in PvP mode for me.

 

I got the impression that the scenes dedicated to PvP were scenes where the Oracle could not see into.

The Black Obsidian Shards must be blocking the Oracles ability to see there.

So in this case the storyline plus peoples desires to have exclusive PvP areas work hand in hand.

Players should then be aware that there are areas that they will never be safe in.

I like this concept and it should stay. I'm not a PvPer but I like areas that are kinda edgy and creepy.


Maybe the PvP/shardfall areas should keep chat transmissions down to make it seem even scarier.

 

I remember that... Maybe it is one the many many JIRA's that got entered and forgotten ! But yeah where is that!!!!?

 

Oh I agree, there should be a cost. At this point in the venture I’d say it wouldn’t hurt to lower some of the costs.

 

Yes, this is what I kean by the wall. The ability to jump into PvP. If you hit a wall, is it worth climbing the wall.

 

I don't have an interest in the Albion game. You wanted to point out how that game is "better" than SOTA, while you decry things like arena and ranked combat zones for PvP groups and... the current ad copy for that game totes those very features as things that were wanted by the player base.

I've been playing MMOs for almost 25 years now. I started WAY back in the Legends of Kesmai on AOL, and before that... Can you count BBS games with text driven engines that were not really MUDs as MMOs? Maybe?. There's not been a single year where I haven't been playing one or more MMOs. I've watched the development of the basic features that have to be in these games for people to enjoy the style of play that they are into. More twitch skill based MMOs, have more success with open style PvP. However with levels and gear that can radically impact the results, tiered PvP arenas/areas/zones are what the industry gravitated towards, because that's how you get more people into the game.

Pure Openworld PvP games are only going to be played by the comparably small population of plenty of free time power gamers, as they are the only type who WILL be competitive. It's not possible to run wildly successful MMOs with just those players in mind. There's been numerous games that touted "Brutal, Open World PvP" that within two to three monts of going live, put in updates to build the walls you decry. Walls that protect the casual gamers, limited time power gamers and the Role-Players from indiscriminate slaughter, you know, the people who literally pay the bills for an MMO. Having open accounts buying time or purchasing virtual widgets in game, without using bandwidth, pays all the bills.

I'm remembering Age of Conan for some reason and a couple of others that folded up pretty darn quick back between 2005 and 2012?

What the hell is with throwing insults at me and others, bro? Do you believe that will help you in some way? It really does nothing to help your case.

Until Portalarium goes live, begins the proper advertising push and works to get more players into the game, talking about these numbers is hardly relevant. Once SOTA goes live, then numbers can begin to be compared, but they have to be compared with like periods of time, 6 months from the go live date of Albion would need to be compared with 6 months of the SOTA go live date.

Look, I want to see PvP power gamers be happy. I'd like to have a reason to PvP, but even with a reason to flag PvP, I have no interest in walking about and being indiscriminately slaughtered by high level characters, because it's "fun" for them to never have a challenge. I'm not asking for an "I Win" button, just a level of equity that puts risk on both parties when PvP happens.

Suggest an idea about what could make it risky for a high level character to indiscriminately slaughter low level noobs, something that has meaning, then perhaps there could be more of a reason to try out PvP. Put your money where your mouth's interest is.

Do you propose that a high level character that initiates attacks against and slaughters noobs be struck with a cumulative, stacking penalty to damage, defense, etc., etc. that can only be cleared by being logged into the game and active for a given period of time or by going through more fair fights?

What about no penalties, as in no xp loss, no ransom, no wear down of equipment and no other penalty at all for a character killed by a character 20ALs or more? Regardless of how the fight started. Like, if I'm flagged PvP with my level 61 toon and you happen upon me with your level 90 toon, the only thing I will lose is time getting to where I was? Also, nothing is gained by the attacker, just the fleeting feeling of virtual murder.

Any other ideas? Instead of complaining about lack of people in PvP and lack of open world, all the time, sandbox PvP, offer up some ideas and solutions as to why I would want to PvP. Guild choke points, etc., etc. all sound good, but why would I want to take part in that, seeing as I will be utterly destroyed by higher end players and suffer a pile of penalties while they get all the rewards?

Maybe if they kill much lower level characters, instead of accruing whatever PvP Points that could exist for control points, guild war elements, etc., they simply lose points, like they are actively working against themselves by picking on the weak? They can, but it won't help them.

 

Haha SotA advertised with brutal open world PVP in russia... Also you claim that you have lots of experience in MMOs but are not able to make money in this one?

I mentioned Albion as successful MMO that also went to 3 years of early access, and that had shown that Arena PVP is not very much liked by sandbox players - and especially when it is not done well.

I never said that griefing shouldn't be stopped. But almost all the stuff you suggested was segregating the playerbase while other suggestions have been made already.
I don't complain the lack of people, because I know exactly why they all left. It is a lack of mechanics. If there would be incentive to help newbies when they have to enter a PVP zone for a quest etc. people will do it. If you need to raise an army, people will help you level quick. That's the sort of mechanics you need in a sandbox, the latter is already in the game but no one is doing it.

I am very much for making faction based PVP, or chaos vs order, good vs evil... etc. Because right now it is just survival of the strongest which does exactly what you say. But it is the LACK OF MECHANICS that promote true sandbox PVP that lead to being an "wolves only" world in PVP. Of course there are still smart people who level with the flag in remote areas undisturbed... but overall there is no incentive and no help for players to risk something.

We had several tournament organizer of which only 1 survived. Sandbox MMOs are the wrong target audience for that. I still very much believe they want to make the game more like UO, and not another theme park.

On the point of advertising etc, surely they will increase the playerbase for a while. But what's most important is the people that stay because they like what they see, and the expectations are met. If you advert brutal PVP like in russia, and there is none - people will start asking questions, like they did on goha.ru.