Why no pvp fighter should flag with the propose ransom changes.

Having to choose to be weak just to be able to pvp is a terrible answer. We should want everyone able to pvp with their best gear not add-on item. If only the rich players wear their best then fights become one sided and more and more people will get frustrate and quit pvp which should be the opposite of what we want them to be.

 

The only way to do this with absolution is through instanced battlegrounds that would raise or lower your stats as so everyone is equal. Otherwise there is so much imbalance between the hardcore players and the casuals that there is no chance really to compete. Things are slightly better with the latest combat announcements. But there are things that still cause imbalance, such as being able to wear pledge rewards and store bought gear in pvp. Those items cannot be looted.

 

So? That doesn't make them better, Actually, that's the solution most people here are suggesting. "Can't afford to lose stuff? Go with basic/store bought gear". Sure I could PvP in my Arabella armor. No-one could loot it. It's offering barely any protection either, though. Store-bought stuff is only for looks and non-lootability. If I subject myself to PvP (which I absolutely want!), I'd rather wear my bone armor (that by the way I could never have afforded. Was a gift from a friend that I will ALWAYS love for that insane generosity).

Another idea came to my mind. Not sure if it has been discussed yet. What if ransom was not only based on item value, but on item value, player level, and difference in player level between the participants? That might be a way to let newer/more casual players PvP without consequences they can't afford, and hopefully get hooked. So the same items costs a level 100 player 10k, but a level 70 only 2k, and no matter the lower player's level, if they are the one defeated, deduct another small amount for every 10 adventurer levels difference? I think I suggested this at another place already. Make it basically uninteresting from a loot perspective to fight players that are far below your level.

 

One other thing to possibly suggest would be to impose a no looting while in pvp mode for lower levels. Once you are at a certain skill level or have mastered a skill set then you can be looted. Just spitballing here.

 

Just ignore common sense Sara. Likewise.

I still think if you cannot risk a ransom on your gear... dont flag is the best way to ensure risk vs reward can be balanced. For the economy it would be even better if some gear gets permanently destroyed when dying... however that should be combined by making the enchanting and masterworking process less random in terms of type selection.

As I said before this is just framework for a meaningful PVP and hopefully a Justice system. This is supposed to be a sandbox not a hugbox. No competition... no cooperation. SotA starts to learn from its competitors and Travian is helping a lot in that regard I assume.

 

One of the ideal things about UO pvp was the fact that you could run out of regs/ammunition. True you could fill your back with as many regs as you could but a loss was then painful and many used to only keep what they needed upon them apart from in sieges when it made sense to stockpile as much as you could carry as you might be there a long time...days at times! In SotA we also have this but with the chance to use regs quite low on many skills, and arrows a pittance of price and now weight(25k easy in a bag) logistics/thought isn't as much of a requirement...and we don't have as yet any meaningful pvp content... I mention because there needs to be a controlling factor to limit a person constantly respawning and fighting especially for when there is a purpose to fight, control of areas, resources, factions etc. Whatever goes into the game now needs to be the kind of system that doesn't need change when more meaningful pvp content is added. There needs to be a deterrent to constant respawning, and making death costly is a painful but needed attribute of the game imo.

Here, i did flag for ages, i had a few fights and was jumped on by people at inopportune moments but the reason i stopped was the need to be constantly watching in case i got stolen from. I used to go the release party flagged and lost all my stuff so from then on i never went again while flagged and in truth the 10% bonus was never even close to being worthwhile as an incentive. In UO it was possible to go afk, perma stealth, towns and guards to a degree, and no stupid players close by indicator showing there's a sheep in the scene... While i have to remain on constant watch for thieves i really wont flag perma again until better overall pvp/meaning mechanics are in the game, as i do like and need to go afk at regular times as i do other things apart from constantly playing and having my total concentration on one game when I'm on. Guild/Faction controlled areas where you know others will be looking out as well will encourage a homeland and a safe space, where people can be in the game but relatively safe..I say relatively as there always does need to be risk, but not a sign saying possible moneybags here ( nearby players) and the ability to take yourself out of worry for a time ( 60 seconds on stealth is not enough).

Also, I have been here 4+ years, i have only ignored 2 people from memory. Each of those times it was only done as a last resort as over a period of months/years there postings were all of one type with an aim or plan behind them. I would never just ignore someone if i don't like their views, everyone is entitled to having a different opinion and saying it without the fear of being ignored if they don't satisfy the norm. Ignoring someone for me will always be a last resort, and no one will ever be ignored for having a different view especially if they state it politely and with reason...But that's me......We all different of course...

 

I don't see an alternative way around instanced PvP battlegrounds either. The current PvP population is so low and the opposition to any meaningful PvP rewards is so high that no other workable options to address the situation exists IMHO.

 

It would be an easy fix for sure... but not in line with the demographic that is their biggest audience.. people who loved UO. And if you think UO PVP is mainly red vs blue... you're wrong.

The power gap will get closer with the changes.. as usage of skill starts to play a more prominent role. Also in terms of power rock paper scissor in terms of your char build will play more of a role. Meaning you can counter high level players eventually.

Arenas that flatten the stats etc remove a lot of reasons to play but need tons of content and rewards to replace that. I highly doubt that SotA could be competitive enough there. The dev team is to small.. we need mechanics that enables players to create the content.

Please keep in mind that the main problem of PVP is the lack of systems implemented. Without proper justice or faction systems it will always end up being a KOS fest.

 

I quite agree with the highlighted passages in your post above. But Vallo, do you honestly think that even if the necessary changes to PvP are done - the PvP base that we lost will come back after all this time?

 

Either that or the game will not last.
We wont see the big competitive guilds come back... but the average joe might find interest again. If they manage to appeal to them I am sure the community can grow. UO is the number 1 term associated with this game.. if people find what they looked for here review scores will increase and more will try.

Its is hard but not impossible. They already sold enough copies to get the 50k playerbase... so potentially nothing is stopping them from taking a look at the game again.

 

Battlegrounds or Scenelimits would be a bad solution and immersion breaking.
They're just hampling around to sarisfy everybody.
Grind is too much for casuals, gap to big and lot of people who dislike hard caps and want limitless progression cannot see that an even playfield is needed, but cannot be installed this way.
It may get better, but to have me,
a desired RPvPer ready, it still needs 3 or more years to get me to level 100.
When you are then level 150+ or so.
I'm 78 and constantly playing, i just dont do what you do and Camp/ grind special spawn Spots for hours.
I do a scene, i maybe do some respawn, but then i go and do something else .
I'd never have fun playing for progression only and fight x repeatedly until i'm dull just to get the XP.
Therefore you all discuss from a pov beeing highlevel already and unable to see some core flaws to get more pvpers.

Yes with hard caps you would be max level in 2 weeks and would not have an incentive anymore because your main incentive is progression.

My main incentice is sandbox RPvX.
To get to the point where X=P i need to be equal strong regarding gamemechanics / stats/ gear and then train to be the better player with good playerskill instead of beeing the better powergrinder with more time and will to grind - or like you'd say to work and put "some" effort in it

If you're waiting for more open world pvp then be sure that the top ten allways be the measure.
Who wants to join a fight against people he cannot beat and has no Chance against.
So you need a certain level and to get to that level it takes a lot of time or a special progress oriented approach to play the game.
Both limits the participants of open PvP.

The limitless system did more limits than you are aware.
It limits to "one class", what now is anounced to be changed in some way.
But we will see if this can be balanced.
Some trees cost very less of xp compared to other trees.
Some trees have only 1 damage skill, some have very powerfull defense etc...
It will be interesting to see what a good pvp setup is and what not.
I'm sure we will see a lot of discussions about Mastery Skills and people with Millions of Pool who train them to 120 soon.
But to be honest before there is no Justice/ Moral/ Virtue System or something that balances ransom etc... PvP is not worthwhile to think about.

 

You need roughly level 80-90 at the moment and you can beat any high level char if you outplay him...

That might even get lower now.. and if you bring friends even more so. You are right on the PVP purpose though. Again as a casual you should organize with others more to get the max out of your play time. No one else is fixing that for you and frankly no one can without alienating others. Learn to play might sound as a derogative term... but it is the best advice someone can give in general.

 

I'm not whining @Vallo Frostbane

You will be sure see me in PvP scenes or flagged if i'm around level 100 and we have something to RPvP with, a pvp related Virtuesystem and such.


Looking forward to a more UO'ish MP and PvP experience and hopefully some friends to go with.

 

If we end up on the same side we can. I am also more on the grey side.. but with so many Glücksbärchies around I need to be evil

 

Balance

 

Easy fix. If you steal you are flagged a certain color and can be killed anywhere for a week. Or just copy UO with the Thieves guild

 

I would love a thieves guild system.

 

No forced PVP in this game, I for one don't pvp ever, nor do i care too, if forced, I'd quit.... I don't play games they force me to pvp period, nor do a lot of others .... And they promised consensual pvp, that's why i invested in this game to begin with. jmho

 

Who did say anything about forcing you to PVP? If you decide not to play content they develop its totally up to you... but certainly won't stop them from making it anymore.

 

There are games that force you to pvp ? 0.o